Donations for the month of March


We have received a total of "0" in donations towards our goal of $175.


Don't want to use PayPal? Go HERE


Forum Search
Member Spotlight
Pilgrim
Pilgrim
NH, USA
Posts: 14,450
Joined: April 2001
Forum Statistics
Forums30
Topics7,781
Posts54,881
Members974
Most Online732
Jan 15th, 2023
Top Posters
Pilgrim 14,447
Tom 4,516
chestnutmare 3,320
J_Edwards 2,615
John_C 1,865
Wes 1,856
RJ_ 1,583
MarieP 1,579
gotribe 1,060
Top Posters(30 Days)
Tom 4
John_C 1
Recent Posts
1 Cor. 6:9-11
by Pilgrim - Thu Mar 28, 2024 2:02 PM
Change in NRSVue text note on 1 John 5:7
by Pilgrim - Thu Mar 28, 2024 11:07 AM
Is the church in crisis
by John_C - Wed Mar 27, 2024 10:52 AM
Jordan Peterson ordered to take sensitivity training
by Tom - Mon Mar 25, 2024 9:00 PM
Should Creeds be read in Church?
by Pilgrim - Mon Mar 25, 2024 6:30 AM
Do Christians have Dual Personalities: Peace & Wretchedness?
by DiscipleEddie - Sat Mar 23, 2024 1:15 PM
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Hop To
#12009 Sat Feb 28, 2004 8:37 AM
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
Enthusiast
OP Offline
Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 227
Likes: 1
In my ethics class I am having to debate the issue of abortion, unfortunately though, I am having to take the pro-
abortion view in the debate.
As hard I try, I can not get myself into the mood to argue for a womans right to kill her unborn child. If there is a good reason for abortion I could use, I can't find it. is there any one who may have some information I could look up that maybe of some help to me? I would appreciate any advice. I would leave the class, but I need the credit for my courses I am taking. It's mandatory and I need a good grade in this.
When I volunteered for the debate, I was hoping to take the pro-life side of the issue. It didn't work out the way I had hoped it would. I now wish I had been on the capital punishment debate instead. At least then I could have a chance of debating either way and not compromise my beliefs as I do belief that there are at least some biblical reasons to be against capital punishment as there are for it. But abortion, I can't find any biblical reason for the killing of an unborn child.

Any help and/or advise would be mostly appreciated along with any prayers you could send up for me. Thanks.


God
bless



Tom


Σεσυς ις Λορδ
4Ever_Learning #12010 Sat Feb 28, 2004 8:59 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,450
Likes: 57
Head Honcho
Offline
Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,450
Likes: 57
Tom,

After leaking out your view concerning capital punishment, i.e., it could go either way <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/scold.gif" alt="" /> perhaps we shouldn't try and help you! [Linked Image] <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" />

Actually, why not argue for abortion in the same illogical, self-centered, ungodly way that they real proponents of abortion on demand do? For example, why not argue that a woman who has a reasonably good job which allows her to lavish herself with all kinds of marvelous trinkets, go out to bars to meet men so she can have illicit sex with them whenever she wants, and basically live the "good life" etc., shouldn't be "penalized" with the result of her choice of lifestyle; a human being growing in her bosom. Thus she should have the "right" to dispose of this human "inconvenience" at will so her "personal freedom" won't be interrupted. Hey, that's how I would argue the case. I would use the same inane arguments they all use.... they HAVE TO BE INANE because they can no longer argue that life doesn't begin at conception since the medical and scientific community has finally admitted that it does. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/evilgrin.gif" alt="" />

Surely, the teacher isn't going to grade you on performance, i.e., your success rate in winning people over to your position? She can only grade you on effort and perhaps enthusiasm, I would think. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/giggle.gif" alt="" />


[Linked Image]

simul iustus et peccator

[Linked Image]
4Ever_Learning #12011 Sat Feb 28, 2004 9:03 AM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,856
Wes Offline
Needs to get a Life
Offline
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,856
Tom,

I don't envy your role in this debate. However if you want to understand the arguments pro-abortionists make you may want to review this Pro-Abortion Link It's really sad how depraved and self-centered abortion arguments are but here are some.

  • Questions concerning abortion:

    What is abortion?

    Abortion is the termination of pregnancy by the induced removal of an embryo or fetus (that is incapable of survival outside the body of the woman) which results in the death of the embryo/fetus.

    What is the essential political issue concerning abortion?

    The essential political question concerning abortion is: does the fetus have a right to be in the body of a woman against the will of the woman? Or: does a woman's body belong to her, or to the government to forcibly dispose of in favor of the fetus?

    Doesn't a fetus have a right to be inside the body of the woman?

    A fetus does not have a right to be in the womb of any woman, but is there by her permission. This permission may be revoked by the woman at any time, because her womb is part of her body. Permissions are not rights. There is no such thing as the right to live inside the body of another, i.e. there is no right to enslave. Contrary to the opinion of anti-abortion activists (falsely called "pro-lifers" as they are against the right to life of the actual human being involved) a woman is not a breeding pig owned by the state (or church). Even if a fetus were developed to the point of surviving as an independent being outside the pregnant woman's womb, the fetus would still not have the right to be inside the woman's womb.

    What applies to a fetus, also applies to a physically
    dependent adult. If an adult—say a medical welfare recipient—must survive by being connected to someone else, they may only do so by the voluntary permission of the person they must be connected to. There is no such thing as the right to live by the efforts of someone else, i.e., there is no such thing as the right to enslave.


This is just a sampling of what you'll find at this site. How tragic these arguments are. But if your going to debate their rights you'll find their position stated at the link above.

Unfortunately you will have to avoid the Bible in your arguments because it puts the value of life as something seen and known by God even before we are knit together in the womb of our mother. (See Psalm 139)


Wes


When I survey the wondrous cross on which the Prince of Glory died, my richest gain I count but loss and pour contempt on all my pride. - Isaac Watts
Pilgrim #12012 Sat Feb 28, 2004 10:13 AM
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
I was going to suggest the same thing that Pilgrim did. In other words, use the arguements that they use on the site that Wes has suggested, but unmask those arguements by stating their position clearly without the use of euphamisms and hiding the self serving purpose of it all.

As to the outcome, your grade and credit, that you would have to leave up to the Lord, trusting Him to either give you favor in their eyes, or to uphold you if this is taken badly and enrages them. I have found that the Lord does both, depending on His will. Sometimes it has cost me dearly in physical terms to take a stand for Him, but there has always been a spiritual blessing, if nothing else the peace of conscience that only He can provide.

In Him,

Gerry

4Ever_Learning #12013 Sat Feb 28, 2004 11:13 AM
Anonymous
Unregistered
Anonymous
Unregistered
May I ask where you go to school?

4Ever_Learning #12014 Sun Feb 29, 2004 5:41 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,516
Likes: 13
Tom Offline
Needs to get a Life
Offline
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,516
Likes: 13
4Ever_Learning

Others have given you some good information on which to form your position.
However, I think it would best to add a qualifier at the start of your presentation i.e. that you are against abortion, but you will try to give a fair representation of the view you were asked to defend.

Also, I really don't have a problem with you having to support the pro-abortion side.
I have read and listened to quite a few of James White's debates and one thing I admire him for is his knowledge of the other side’s issues.
He has even defended Mormon's against (supposed) Christian’s false accusations against them, while not compromising the real issues.

One of the reasons why you and I have such a hard time with the pro-abortion’s arguments is that we correctly see them through the lens of Scripture.
In the past I have made the mistake of listening to pro-abortionists without being able to use biblical reasons against abortion. The reason for this of course is because many in the secular world dismiss any argument from Scripture as just the ranting of ignorant fundamentalists. At the time, I tried to accommodate them by not using well reasoned scriptural answers.
However over time after listening to people like James White and John MacArthur unapologetically use Scripture and let God do His bidding, I soon began to realize that I was compromising what I believed by doing this.

All that said, I am glad it isn't me that is being asked to support the pro-abortion side.


Link Copied to Clipboard
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 84 guests, and 17 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
PaulWatkins, His Unworthy Son, Nahum, TheSojourner, Larry
974 Registered Users
ShoutChat
Comment Guidelines: Do post respectful and insightful comments. Don't flame, hate, spam.
March
S M T W T F S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
31
Today's Birthdays
There are no members with birthdays on this day.
Popular Topics(Views)
1,506,457 Gospel truth