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Pilgrim
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#2243 - Fri Apr 18, 2003 2:01 PM Re: Evanescense  
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We've kind of moved from the topic of choruses to music in general. Neither Evanescence nor Kathy Troccoli are in hymnals.


True godliness is a sincere feeling which loves God as Father as much as it fears and reverences Him as Lord, embraces His righteousness, and dreads offending Him worse than death~ Calvin
#2244 - Fri Apr 18, 2003 2:02 PM Re: Evanescense [Re: MarieP]  

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oh sorry but I saw Evanscence on this post and thought it was somehow related!

#2245 - Fri Apr 18, 2003 2:05 PM Re: Evanescense  
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That's ok...it was related to the thing about Kathy Troccoli


True godliness is a sincere feeling which loves God as Father as much as it fears and reverences Him as Lord, embraces His righteousness, and dreads offending Him worse than death~ Calvin
#2246 - Fri Apr 18, 2003 2:18 PM Re: Evanescense [Re: MarieP]  
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I'm just curious to know if any of you who are listening to and/or praising CCM have ever read this article by Leonard Payton:<br><br>Is it a Prelude or a Quaalude??<br><br>In His Grace,


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#2247 - Fri Apr 18, 2003 7:25 PM Re: Modern Praise Choruses  

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That is awesome! And I'll be praying.

#2248 - Sat Apr 19, 2003 6:54 AM Re: Evanescense [Re: Pilgrim]  

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Well let's not forget this excellent article also:
Glossary of Church Growth & Christian Contemporary Music Terminology

I know I access this daily when I can't understand CCM speak.

#2249 - Mon Apr 21, 2003 2:10 AM Where angels fear to tread.. [Re: MarieP]  
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Lest the baby be trhrown out with the bathwater...<br><br>The problem with modern choruses is the route by which they enter the church. Perhaps one or more church members encounter them at a christian (usually charismatic) conference, or hear them on the radio, or on a CD. Then pressure is placed on the pastor to include them to satisfy the desires of these members. And so he includes them without considering whether they are orthodox or singable (what sounds fine on a CD sung by a professional musician may drive your classically trained pianist/organist nuts trying to get the timing right and leave your congregation behind). Alternatively they are introduced by a "worship leader" whose theological acumen leaves something to be desired and over whom the leadreship fo the church seems to exercise no practical control. Those, in my view, are the abuses of modern choruses.<br><br>However, there is another side. Perhaps your songs are chosen by a pastor who gives careful thought to words and music. He filters out the dross and keeps the gold (as has been done with Wesley). Those that are sung are perhaps scripture set to music, or helpful, if brief meditations on it. And then there are the longer modern songs, that are really hymns in disguise, and are also helpful and edifying to the church.<br><br>What we should remember is that music in a pop genre is not inherently sinful, anymore than an impressionist painting is satanic. The question is whether its use is edifying to the people of God. The fault mainly lies in an uncritical adoption of the new, a hasty repudiation of the old and the failure of pastors to learn how to choose appropriate music or take advice from others with the gift to do so.<br><br>In Christ,<br><br>James.

#2250 - Mon May 05, 2003 3:06 PM Re: Modern Praise Choruses [Re: MarieP]  

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I must agree in the inanity of most, and I mean most, of the "praise" choruses used in church today. I just happen to be looking at the bulletin from our worship yesterday and here is a sampling of the fare. "Alleluia" which consists of singing alleluia 8 times and then "he's my savior"<br>8 times, then "I will praise him" 8 times and whatever other pithy phrases our music leader can think of. It leaves me really desiring "Sacred head thou wounded" next "let the redeemed of the Lord say so" but then the redeemed never really say anything in this chorus, and so it goes. We have this great hymn book with great old hymns we just got a couple of years ago and we never use them because we print the choruses in the bulletin. I think the problem is we are trying to elicit some kind of "feeling" about God through he music rather than extol his virtues because we see worship as something for us not something to God. Songs with theology that tell us about God's attributes and greatness are almost non-existent I think because it either is'nt entertaining enough or its just to old fashioned. It really is a shame. Give me "mighty Fortress" or give me death

#2251 - Mon May 05, 2003 3:52 PM Re: Modern Praise Choruses  

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I once read an article by John McArthur about modern praise. The Vineyard is responsible for the way a lot of worship is being practiced. It is from the Vineyard that started to use overheads so hymnals wouldn't encumber the lifting of hands. Also the song selection is geared toward allowing the congregation to be brought an an emotional worshipful catharsis. While I do enjoy some of the worship music that we play at my church I still get more excited when a good ole hymn is placed on the overhead. Last night we sang "The Deep Deep Love of Jesus". Spine tingling, God glorifying, pride reducing, praise.

#2252 - Mon May 05, 2003 5:11 PM Re: Modern Praise Choruses  
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Entertainment has replaced biblical worship today. But this isn't something "new"...... !! Here's a couple of short quips from the "Prince of Preachers":<br><br>No Compromise!<br><br>Feeding Sheep or Amusing Goats?<br><br>In His Grace,


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#2253 - Mon May 05, 2003 10:42 PM A friend and I are working on a worship ditty [Re: MarieP]  

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Tell me what you think there are the lyrics that I wrote. It is a first draft mind. Give feed back please

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#2254 - Wed May 07, 2003 6:58 PM Re: Modern Praise Choruses [Re: MarieP]  
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Can I get an Amen, Brother?<br><br>AMEN!!<br><br><br><br><br>Sorry I just had to say that. Anyway, what you said is right on. This is kind of off-topic, but I once listened to a preacher on the radio preach about the hymn "Blessed Assurance". Everyone around me (mostly Contemporary Christian types) agreed completely! I was left wondering (like the commercial), "Where's the Beef?" I was dumbfounded that he would not be preaching from the gospel and instead was using a hymnal! I let my opinions be known and I got "The Stare". You could almost hear the crickets chirping in the background (like in old Daffy Duck (R)(TM)(C)(Whatever) cartoons). One of my more liberal friends said that he "thought it was alright to talk about how we are assured of our salvation" and how he was using a "non-traditional" way of presenting it. Sure. Anyway, just wanted to talk about that.


In the midst of your sadness and woe, when you are tormented and afflicted, have comfort! God's will is done.
#2255 - Thu May 15, 2003 4:30 PM Re: Evanescense [Re: MarieP]  
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Ah, yes. More modern, "Christian" music. Just like Creed, isn't it? I must say, I really hate all of this modern "music". Which is funny because everyone else in my family loves it! BAH!!! Give me Bach's Sacred Choral music any day of the week. <br><br>*headphones go on* Oh, yeah! *singing* Christ lag in todesbaden...<br><br>[img]http://www.the-highway.com/w3timages/icons/groovin.gif" alt="groovin" title="groovin[/img]


In the midst of your sadness and woe, when you are tormented and afflicted, have comfort! God's will is done.
#2256 - Mon Jun 02, 2003 7:05 PM Come Thou Fount [Re: MarieP]  

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We were having a discussion last night about the hymn, "Come Thou Fount of Every Blessing". We all seemed to agree that the hymn ends on a downer, namely, that the writer is stating "prone to wander Lord, I feel it, prone to leave the God I love." The following line is "take my heart and seal it," but it still leaves the impression that the writer feels defeated, instead of having confidence in Christ and that the new birth gives you victory and power through Christ, and that you DO have the power to defeat Satan since Christ has already done so. <br><br>Now, I understand that this is a humble admission of the weakness of man; we all struggle with sin; the verse can be reminiscent of David in the Psalms. But, why stay there, when you have confidence in Christ and the Holy Spirit working in your life? I am working on a 4th verse to the hymn to end it on a more positive note. <br><br>Has anyone else noticed this?

#2257 - Mon Jun 02, 2003 7:20 PM Re: Come Thou Fount  
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MLBorrusch,<br><br>First off, welcome to The Highway Discussion Board!! [Linked Image]<br><br>I can understand what you are saying, however, since the Psalms are inspired and not so with our hymns, if I had to choose a model by which to write a hymn, I believe that the Psalms are more than adequate as examples of which you admit do not always end on a joyous or "up beat" note. Like the Psalms I believe all our man-made hymns should reflect the whole gamut of our new life in Christ, including our confession of sin and weaknesses. In so doing, we also confess our total dependency on Christ's atoning blood and God's sovereign providence. You may not agree with how the contemporary church expresses itself in perpetual ecstasy in the mundane and inane "mindless mantras" of the infamous Praise Choruses, but it is this type of one-sidedness and distortion of the reality of God, Christ, salvation and the true experience of the Christian life, that seems to predominate the "music" of today's modern churches. Frankly, I have a great appreciation for how this particular hymns end, for it surely does express my own heart's cry when I take a sober look at how I live before God. [img]http://www.the-highway.com/w3timages/icons/grin.gif" alt="grin" title="grin[/img]<br><br>In His Grace,


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