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Drinking and drunkeness #38521
Wed Dec 05, 2007 7:51 PM
Wed Dec 05, 2007 7:51 PM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 71
Az, USA,
Clint Offline OP
Journeyman
Clint  Offline OP
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Az, USA,
Does the Bible say anywhere that drinking wine or beer or anything of the nature in and of itself is a sin? Or only that being drunk and living a life bonded to drunkenness a sin?

A few people I know will take part in total abstinence from drinking because their view is this, "why would I drink something out of leisure that does nothing but hinder my walk and ability to think" which is fair enough in itself.. But they also scoff at those who do drink.

I just want to ask this one guy in particular.. "Why do you watch family guy on tv? Isn't family guy a TV show that makes fun of God and His commands and yet you still watch?" But I was not sure if my argument against his really held water because I was not sure what exactly the Bible says about drinking..

Re: Drinking and drunkeness [Re: Clint] #38522
Wed Dec 05, 2007 9:34 PM
Wed Dec 05, 2007 9:34 PM
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John_C Offline

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John_C  Offline

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Obviously, the Bible does not consider alcohol a sin. Just drunkeness.

As a teetotaler I always wanted to ask this question. Doesn't everyone sin a few times by drunkenesss before they learn to be sober social drinkers. IOW, in order to learn not to sin, you have to sin a few times before getting to that point. In addition, what is drunkeness? Is it a slight buzz or feeling gidy, or is it more?


John Chaney

"having been firmly rooted and now being built up in Him and established in your faith . . ." Colossians 2:7
Re: Drinking and drunkeness [Re: John_C] #38523
Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:02 PM
Wed Dec 05, 2007 11:02 PM
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T
Theo Offline
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Theo  Offline
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T
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Clint,

The main reason I wound up concluding, after being raised as a teetotaler, that alcoholic beverages in and of themselves are not sinful is that we know our Lord never sinned, yet he turned water into wine at Cana and drank wine at the Last Supper. If he never sinned, those could not have been sinful acts. I agree with John C that DRUNKENESS is what is sinful.

And in the Old Testament, well, Psalm 104 thanks God for wine:

14 He causeth the grass to grow for the cattle, and herb for the service of man: that he may bring forth food out of the earth;

15 And wine that maketh glad the heart of man, and oil to make his face to shine, and bread which strengtheneth man's heart.


So I honestly don't see how wine or other alcoholic drink could be sinful in and of itself. ( I realize some argue that the wine of Biblical times was not the same as what we call wine, but I don't think that is a very convincing argument, for why else would the Scriptures warn against drunkeness?)

Theo

Re: Drinking and drunkeness [Re: John_C] #38524
Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:27 PM
Thu Dec 06, 2007 9:27 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
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Kentucky
MarieP Offline
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MarieP  Offline
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Quote
As a teetotaler I always wanted to ask this question. Doesn't everyone sin a few times by drunkenesss before they learn to be sober social drinkers. IOW, in order to learn not to sin, you have to sin a few times before getting to that point. In addition, what is drunkeness? Is it a slight buzz or feeling gidy, or is it more?


That actually was my question several years ago. (I may have even asked it here, come to think of it). But personally, the answer is no, especially since I only drink one glass of wine and that with food. As to the question of "giddiness" I really can't say I've had that experience. More relaxed yes, but can't say I've felt giddy.

Just my two cents...


True godliness is a sincere feeling which loves God as Father as much as it fears and reverences Him as Lord, embraces His righteousness, and dreads offending Him worse than death~ Calvin
Re: Drinking and drunkeness [Re: Theo] #38525
Fri Dec 07, 2007 12:41 AM
Fri Dec 07, 2007 12:41 AM
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 71
Az, USA,
Clint Offline OP
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Clint  Offline OP
Journeyman
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Az, USA,
Thank you very much John, Marie, and Theo. This helps quite a bit. You just affirmed what I had already concluded.. However I was unsure of myself because I have been raised in a home that is less reserved than most.. and because of that I thought maybe I just had a little bit of a skewed view.. Anyways, thanks again!

Re: Drinking and drunkenness [Re: Clint] #38526
Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:45 AM
Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:45 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,537
NH, USA
Pilgrim Offline

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Pilgrim  Offline

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Posts: 13,537
NH, USA
Clint,

Consider the following:


1 Timothy 5:23 "Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities." (If drinking wine (alcohol) is sin, then Paul just counseled Timothy to sin and that as a young pastor.)

Titus 1:7 "For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not selfwilled, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;" (here the optimum phrase is "not given to", i.e., addicted to drinking wine (alcohol). cf. Eph 5:18; 1Tim 3:3, 8; Titus 2:3


In His grace,


[Linked Image]

simul iustus et peccator

[Linked Image]
Re: Drinking and drunkeness [Re: Clint] #54979
Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:45 AM
Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:45 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 88
Morgantown, WV
lazarus Offline
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lazarus  Offline
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Morgantown, WV
Instead of starting a new thread I thought I'd use this old one to ask a nagging question that's troubling our church.

Q: What does the Bible mean when it refers to wine as making the heart glad? How so?

Thanks.

...wait, what, only 88 posts attributed to me? I had thousands when I left here back in the early 2000's! ;-)

Last edited by lazarus; Sun Jun 24, 2018 11:46 AM.
Re: Drinking and drunkeness [Re: lazarus] #54980
Sun Jun 24, 2018 5:52 PM
Sun Jun 24, 2018 5:52 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,537
NH, USA
Pilgrim Offline

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Pilgrim  Offline

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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,537
NH, USA
Originally Posted by lazarus
Instead of starting a new thread I thought I'd use this old one to ask a nagging question that's troubling our church.

Q: What does the Bible mean when it refers to wine as making the heart glad? How so?

A little wine, like all alcohol, makes one relax and thus allows one to think on the good things in life and forget to one degree or another the day's problems. bravo {This does not condone drunkenness, which should be a given.}

Originally Posted by lazarus
...wait, what, only 88 posts attributed to me? I had thousands when I left here back in the early 2000's! ;-)

Hmmmm, how to explain this? scratchchin There have been several major upgrades to the forum software and in the process of doing so, some things were either not compatible or didn't get carried over. One of those items was the post count. I got 'robbed' (no pun intended) too. giggle


[Linked Image]

simul iustus et peccator

[Linked Image]
Re: Drinking and drunkeness [Re: lazarus] #54981
Mon Jun 25, 2018 12:28 AM
Mon Jun 25, 2018 12:28 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,556
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,556
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Quote
wait, what, only 88 posts attributed to me? I had thousands when I left here back in the early 2000's! ;-)


Hi old friend, hope to see thousands more. wink

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Mon Jun 25, 2018 12:30 AM.

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