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#48826 - Monday, May 28, 2012 5:00 PM The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly
Robin Offline

The Boy Wonder

Registered: Thursday, January 3, 2002
Posts: 1007
Loc: Florida, Occupied CSA
So the PCA has invited these "evolutionists" to speak at the next General Assembly meeting (see the story here). Biologos is not just about the age of the earth. They want to introduce the PCA to the "good news" of biological evolution.

I wonder why the "powers that be" in the PCA have allowed this?

A blogger I follow describes Biologos' work this way:

Quote:
Biologos offers a view of evolution that is completely incompatible with Christianity. Justification and imputation will go completely down the tubes, if we allow their view into our midst, thus contradicting the first Adam-last Adam Christology of Romans 5 and 1 Corinthians 15. "Welcome, wolves, to the flock. We're so glad you're here. Is there anything we can do to make your stay more comfortable? Can we serve you any mutton?"


I have heard a few people theorize that takes about 40 years for a denomination to stray to the point of apostasy. If there's any truth to that, I guess the PCA is about due. First Federal Vision, now this?


_________________________
A Sidekick's Blog: The Superhero's mission through the eyes of His faithful Sidekick

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#48827 - Monday, May 28, 2012 8:34 PM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: Robin]
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho

Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13321
Loc: NH, USA
Dr. Paul Elliot has been trying to get people to realize what is going on in the PCA and likewise in the OPC for quite some time; see HERE. But there aren't many who are going to take these things seriously, I fear. I vividly remember the gradual demise of the CRC back in the '70s. There were those who continually warned of what would happen due to the deception of the 'leadership' and the ignorance and apathy of the typical church member. History is replete with examples of denominations/churches rising and falling. The pattern is nearly identical in every case; the professors and pastors cast off the truth as found in Scripture and summarized in the official Confessions of faith and Catechisms of their respective denominations/churches ever so subtly who in turn then teach the laity (cf. Hosea 4:6f). And... in nearly every single case, the laity are always heard to say, "Not MY denomination/church!!... nope"
_________________________


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#48829 - Tuesday, May 29, 2012 9:13 PM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: Robin]
goldenoldie Offline
Plebeian

Registered: Friday, May 18, 2012
Posts: 9
Loc: Masschusetts, USA
I'm a PCA member, and it's sad that I have to find out second-hand, from the postings here, about the Federal Vision ruling in April, and now this biologos debacle — instead of from my own session.

Without knowledge, how can members pray for their church and their denomination?

How do members of large denominations typically obtain information about presbytery, synod and general assembly meetings? Or do clergy tacitly assume that the laity do not need to know?
_________________________
In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

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#48830 - Wednesday, May 30, 2012 5:15 AM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: goldenoldie]
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho

Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13321
Loc: NH, USA
Originally Posted By: goldenoldie
Without knowledge, how can members pray for their church and their denomination?

True, without knowing what is going on the members of a church/denomination are blind and assume the status quo, i.e., things are just dandy. Not only does ignorance prevent members from praying but no less important, they are incapable of doing anything about those things which are contrary to biblical teaching and contrary to the official Confession of Faith and/or Catechism which officers have sworn to embrace and uphold. In short, the members cannot hold any of those ordained to positions of service (they really dislike people describing their responsible positions as 'servants') and authority to account for their deviation in doctrine and/or life.

Originally Posted By: goldenoldie
How do members of large denominations typically obtain information about presbytery, synod and general assembly meetings? Or do clergy tacitly assume that the laity do not need to know?

Each denomination has their respective policies regarding the publishing of meetings, decisions, etc. So, it is difficult to give you a definitive answer. However, one can make a request to whatever 'level' for the information you are wanting to know. On the local level, it should be quite simple to ask any elder for information. Unfortunately, e.g., the PCA and OPC, bifurcate the office of elder and only 'Teaching Elders' are authorized to attend Presbytery and General Assembly meetings officially. It used to be that the general public was allowed to attend General Assembly or Synod meetings and/or obtain written transcripts and audio recordings of the proceedings.

As to the second part of your comment, I tend to be suspicious by nature due to my being a true Calvinist, giggle who is very aware of the depravity of the soul of ALL men. It seems that in the modern church, office bearers, specifically [teaching] elders, aka: Pastors are more like politicians. They are arrogant, proud, secretive, deceptive, hungry for power and fame. Oh, they may hide these sins quite well beneath a phoney soft, sweet demeanor and woe unto anyone who would suggest these men are anything but humble, loving, self-sacrificial servants of God. My friend, know this... there IS what is known as a "fraternity of elders" in which you will find the old "mutual admiration society", aka: you scratch my back and I'll scratch yours. And one of the most widely held, yet again clandestine tenets of many (most?) elders is, "BEWARE of the bleating of the sheep!". You see, an informed laity is potentially a serious threat to those who do not desire to be held accountable. Academia rules and within the halls of Academia, there are very lax rules and men are encouraged to think "outside the box". As example, just think for a second about the doctrinal programs in every institution; secular and sacred. The doctrinal candidate is required to write a dissertation that deals with something NEW, something which hasn't been dealt with before. This kind of requirement, aka: pressure... in far too many cases leads to a deformity or even denial of established truth rather than a clearer understanding and application of it. The irony is that this requirement to obtain a PhD, which is basically a document which certifies you have read lots of books on a particular subject, conformed to a school's policies and paid a substantial fee, is ancient...

Quote:
Acts 17:21 (ASV) "Now all the Athenians and the strangers sojourning there spent their time in nothing else, but either to tell or to hear some new thing."

This mentality is far too over representative within the leaders of the churches. Pragmatism rather than conformity to the truth is what drives most. I won't bore you with a long list of examples which abound in the modern church. And, I'm not referring to Evanjellycalism, which has it's own problems nope I'm referring to so-called "REFORMED" churches.

Lastly, if you are just now learning of what is going on in the PCA, I believe you are far too late. There is MUCH more going on in the PCA and is now established in the PCA than FV and the matter of Creationism vs. Theistic Evolution, Framework Theory, Pre-Adamic Race, etc. When I was in seminary, one of the 'clever' bits of advice to those seeking the pulpit ministry was put this way... "Do not turn the piano all at once so it is facing the correct/better way. Turn the piano a degree or two each week. That way no one will even notice." That's how churches/denominations fall... and they ALL fall. It is in small increments. Little things are changed at first and before you realize it, the church has gone far off the path. And then it is too late.

As I stated before, the majority of members (laity) really don't want to hear about problems within their respective churches/denominations. They are like the parents whose child was caught red-handed breaking windows. When the police officer brings the child to his home and the parents come to the door, after hearing what the child was caught doing, they refuse to believe it and so often exclaim, "NO... Not MY kid!! He would NEVER do anything like that. You must be mistaken. You've got the wrong kid!" Ignoring or worse, hiding error is a guarantee of disaster. EVERY.. EVERY heretic and those who follow them will cry "love, love one another, tolerance is most important. Do not enter into controversy. Peace at all costs."
_________________________


simul iustus et peccator


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#48831 - Wednesday, May 30, 2012 5:45 PM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: Robin]
Robin Offline

The Boy Wonder

Registered: Thursday, January 3, 2002
Posts: 1007
Loc: Florida, Occupied CSA
Quote:
Unfortunately, e.g., the PCA and OPC, bifurcate the office of elder and only 'Teaching Elders' are authorized to attend Presbytery and General Assembly meetings officially. It used to be that the general public was allowed to attend General Assembly or Synod meetings and/or obtain written transcripts and audio recordings of the proceedings.


The two denominations do "bifurcate" the office of Elder - unbiblically in my opinion - into "teaching elder" (clergy) and "ruling elder" (non-clergy). It is not true, however, that only teaching elders are allowed at Presbytery meetings. Throughout my term as a deacon in a PCA church, I was welcomed at meetings of our presbytery (Central Florida) and participated in several presbytery-wide workshops there. Only elders (ruling elders and teaching elders) could vote at those meetings, but anyone could attend. My pastor encouraged members to go to presbytery meetings.

The rules may be different from one presbytery to another, however. So depending on where one lives, "your mileage may vary," as the saying goes. I don't think that access to records of the General Assembly is restricted either, other than pending trial transcripts perhaps.

My current pastor (PCA) hasn't bothered with General Assembly for nearly a decade. My former PCA pastor goes to every one. When enough conservative, biblical "T.E.'s" forgo attendance of the GA, they unwittingly increase the influence of the more theologically liberal ones. The result is a slow, hidden, "creeping liberalism" that begins with "tolerance" and ends in apostasy.

_________________________
A Sidekick's Blog: The Superhero's mission through the eyes of His faithful Sidekick

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#48832 - Wednesday, May 30, 2012 9:30 PM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: Pilgrim]
goldenoldie Offline
Plebeian

Registered: Friday, May 18, 2012
Posts: 9
Loc: Masschusetts, USA
Thanks, Pilgrim. That was the best rant I've ever read BigThumbUp

I am indeed too late. I suspected this all along, but it's difficult to connect with brethren of like mind and heart.

Perhaps the most toxic fault with Reformed churches is the belief that mainstream evangelistic methods and rationales are fine... demonstrating either a failure to appreciate the ramifications of (double) predestination, or a total disdain for it. I don't think anything apart from the doctrine of seeking (so ably expounded by the late Dr. Gerstner) is consistent with Dordt. Faulty evangelism poisons the source, allowing more tares to be sown among the wheat. These tares become the dominant members, and, in time, elders and pastors are drawn from them.

The obsession with peace and unity of the church is so rife that friendship with Rome is regarded as brotherly. Sadly, the Westminster Confession's identification of the office of the Pope as the Antichrist has been taken out of American versions; I don't think the Reformers were wrong on this one. But the floodgates have been opened, and for too long.

The peace that the modern church seeks is the peace of the graveyard.
_________________________
In this was manifested the love of God toward us, because that God sent his only begotten Son into the world, that we might live through him.

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#48833 - Wednesday, May 30, 2012 11:29 PM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: Pilgrim]
Tom Offline
Needs to get a Life

Registered: Sunday, April 8, 2001
Posts: 3885
Loc: Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Pilgrim
Sad, but interesting reading.
Kind of reminds me of CH Spurgeon and the Down Grade Controversy.
http://www.spurgeon.org/downgrd.htm

I just re-read the articles in that link and I think I can honestly say that it should almost be required reading for anybody who is serious about the pure unadulterated Word of God.

Tom


Edited by Tom (Thursday, May 31, 2012 12:43 AM)

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#48834 - Thursday, May 31, 2012 6:19 AM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: goldenoldie]
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho

Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13321
Loc: NH, USA
Originally Posted By: goldenoldie
Perhaps the most toxic fault with Reformed churches is the belief that mainstream evangelistic methods and rationales are fine... demonstrating either a failure to appreciate the ramifications of (double) predestination, or a total disdain for it. I don't think anything apart from the doctrine of seeking (so ably expounded by the late Dr. Gerstner) is consistent with Dordt. Faulty evangelism poisons the source, allowing more tares to be sown among the wheat. These tares become the dominant members, and, in time, elders and pastors are drawn from them.
<CUT>
The peace that the modern church seeks is the peace of the graveyard.

I'm afraid we are guilty of going

However, I'm going to respond nonetheless, invoking my Administrator license. evilgrin Perhaps another thread/topic on the matter of modern evangelism vs. traditional/biblical evangelism would be a profitable discussion.

Faulty evangelism has been adopted by mainstream "Reformed" churches for several decades. Again, even when I was at WTS in the late '70s, one John C. Miller had begun a work called, "New Life Presbyterian Church" in which he brought in/adopted a contemporary (aka: Charismatic) worship style. He printed and handed out little evangelism tracts which were nothing more than a revamped "Four Spiritual Laws", made popular by Bill Bright and Campus Crusade for Christ; based on semi-Pelagian doctrine. I was shocked to see the open reception of Miller's 'new work' by many of my fellow seminarians. Then James D. Kennedy gained in popularity with his non-biblical, political 'sermons' and Hollywood show business 'worship' at Coral Ridge Presbyterian Church. His book Evangelism Explosion, literally exploded in popularity which I accredit to the effective use of the very principle which the book was based on... Madison Avenue marketing techniques, aka: salesmanship via deceptive psychological and emotional manipulation. Consequently, this book and similar approaches which do NOT present the biblical gospel, produce a plethora of alleged professing Christians who are yet dead in their sins and who are openly received as members of the church.

One of the most detrimental consequences or results of this mass of unregenerate "Christians" is a lack of discernment, which only the Holy Spirit can provide. Thus, Arminians/semi-Pelagians are embraced as true brethren who are simply lacking in proper training. In truth, this type of mentality within Reformed churches/denominations, amounts to nothing more than assimilation of the world and the lies of the Devil...!!! But again, anyone who even hints at such a thing is immediately branded as unloving, unChrist-like, uncharitable, intolerant, and a host of other pejoratives. Unfortunately, there are also those who go too far the other way and claim that anyone who believes that Arminians/semi-Pelagians are saved without exception whatsoever are not saved either. Although such people are in the small minority, they are quite boisterous and can be found ranting their castigations and condemnations on many of the social networking groups. Lastly, it must be realized that all of the above isn't restricted to just the laity. nope It predominates in the clergy as well who are teaching such things to their respective congregations. And it is also being taught in the seminaries as well.

Heresy of every variety historically comes from the teachers of the church, both in the academic institutions and from the pulpit. Unregenerate 'christians' have no ability nor interest in discerning truth vs. error. And very few true Christians are practicing Bereans (Acts 17:11). So there is a two-edged guiltiness which falls upon those given to feed and guard the sheep (Acts 20:28-30) and every believer to study the Word prayerfully and grow in the knowledge of Christ (Jh 8:31; Heb 6:1,2; 2Pet 3:14-18).

Okay.... I'm done! rofl
_________________________


simul iustus et peccator


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#48836 - Thursday, May 31, 2012 7:04 AM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: goldenoldie]
John_C Offline

Permanent Resident

Registered: Saturday, September 15, 2001
Posts: 1899
Loc: Mississippi Gulf Coast
If you want to keep up with the goings-on in the PCA and other denoms, go to the Aquila Report.

Here is a report you may want to read.

http://theaquilareport.com/pcas-standing...don-k-clements/

There are very few of the Presbyteries that gives any edge to the Federal Vision stuff. I think there might be around 67 presbyteries and 4 at most may be supportive. This particular case was just trialed in one of those. The PCA SJC told them to re-trial it as their findings went against PCA polity. Oh, the PCA loss an entire Presbytery a couple of years ago due to its FV influence. That was the Presbytery with Wilkins, and when he was set for trial. The whole presbytery pulled out.

Likewise, this evolution stuff is in only a few of the presbyteries, and even those will dance around it.

Their are several overtures this year from presbyteries rejecting any biologos claims, so I'm sure one of them will be approved. The committee who scheduled the seminar appeared to drop the ball on this. I'm not even sure if the two speakers are affiliated with Biologos or not, not even on how supportive of biologos claims. Still, the committee
mishandled this big time.

_________________________
John Chaney

"having been firmly rooted and now being built up in Him and established in your faith . . ." Colossians 2:7

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#48838 - Thursday, May 31, 2012 8:18 AM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: Robin]
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho

Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13321
Loc: NH, USA
John,

I would have to dispute the claims above as far as how widespread FV and aberrant views of the doctrine of creation exist within the PCA and the OPC. The "official" position as reported by the individual presbyteries is no indication of what is actually going on within the PCA. FV and its variations have infiltrated way beyond what the "report" claims. In other words, there are individual elders and teachers within the PCA who have long held to FV(ism) and continue to promote it without reprisal. There was a member here who was attending RTS who was appalled to see several professors there promoting Federal Vision ideas. The Peter Leithart case is but one example of the PCA's failure to discipline someone who holds to FV.

Several times now I have referred people to THIS ARTICLE which I believe is a far more accurate assessment of the problems existing within the PCA. I have read a couple of Dr. Elliot's books and his documentation is impeccable. Most within the PCA will expectedly gloss over the severity of the issues plaguing the denomination so as to not create panic among its members. Some intentionally hide the facts because they are of the "tolerant" ilk or even share a sympathetic attitude with those holding to and/or teaching heresy.

I say again, the PCA, which isn't the only denomination to be singled out, is speeding down the road to apostasy because of its failure to hold fast to the truth once delivered unto the saints and the Westminster Standards and to discipline those who are guilty of the same.

Adding to the problem are those who insist that the denomination only has a minor infection but in truth it has cancer.
_________________________


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#48843 - Friday, June 1, 2012 12:43 AM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: goldenoldie]
Jobeluan65 Offline
Journeyman

Registered: Friday, January 20, 2012
Posts: 54
Loc: Germany
Dr. John Gerstner, in evaluating a preliminary draft of the Confession of 1967, labeled it "the greatest doctrinal disaster in the history of Presbyterianism" and a "slander to our Presbyterian fathers." But when he later focused on the change in the subscription vow as approved by the General Assembly of 1966, he claimed that the intent of that Assembly made the "instruction and guidance" to be "tantamount to believing what is catholic, evangelical, and reformed in the Book of Confessions." That eliminated, he reasoned, the neo-orthodox elements of the Confession. Gerstner concluded that the new vow rendered the UPCUSA, "in its officially subscribed documents, more catholic, evangelical, and reformed than ever before.” In the late 1960’s Dr. Gerstner stayed in the UPUSA. One could question why he did so, and I am sure many have, but in good conscience he stayed as a minister of the Gospel of Christ Jesus.

Again we read these words of Dr. John Gerstner, a former Professor at the Pittsburgh Theological Seminary. They ring with the same truth and urgency today as when they were delivered more than a quarter of a century ago on February 19, 1981: ”Almost all who have examined and approved this manifesto have been in the United Presbyterian Church for a long time, some in the ministry for 40 years and more while we have seen our mother, our church, slowly dying. We have stayed all the more determinedly by her side to prevent the disaster if we could. It has been shown now that we cannot do so. Our mother, our church, has died. We must bury her, unless under God, this General Assembly raises her again from the dead. This we most fervently pray will be the case. It is utterly impossible for the United Presbyterian Church to profess the Christian religion and at the same time to authorize demonstrated unbelievers in the Christian religion to serve in her ministry. This is intolerable and if a church persists in it, it ceases to be a church of Jesus Christ. We are not to come out and separate from a professing Christian body until Christ leaves that body. When that body rejects Christ’s authority and His doctrine can He any longer consider that body His? Many once noble churches have fallen away and have had their candlestick removed. It seems to us that Christ is about to do the same with our own United Presbyterian Church.”

Dr. Gerstner, a conservative Christian stayed in with the liberal Presbyterian Church for years and years when many left long before he did. His writings have many times been seen on the Highway Discussion Board as thoughts to be recognized. Like Dr. Gerstner, I am not in favor of leaving the PCA at this juncture, and certainly not because of Dr. Elliott’s words posted on the Highway Discussion Board. From his website Teaching The Word Ministries, Dr. Elliott makes this statement, “What a pathetic sight the PCA has become - especially its so-called conservative faction. If men of this mindset had been given the job of fighting the Nazis seventy years ago, we would all be speaking German today.” That statement by Dr. Elliott is actually saying God has less control than mankind. I do not know you or your elders, but I do not believe your elders are “pathetic” in their oversight of the local body of Christ. I ask you to consider going to you elders and enter into a discussion about your biblical understanding of Biologos. “If in good conscience you believe they are not listening to you or they agree with the teaching of Biologos, then you will need to take someone else with you and explain why you believe Biologos is not in harmony with the Bible. If they still do not listen to you and your concerns then you need to elevate your concerns to Presbytery. Our God is not distant, or away on a short vacation, or asleep, or not active in every square inch of the cosmos. “All mankind will come and bow down before him” ….. even the creators of Biologos or any unbiblical aspect of the PCA, OPC, OCRC, CREC, RBC, URC, PR, ERPC, etc.

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#48845 - Friday, June 1, 2012 6:38 AM Re: The PCA Welcomes Biologos to the next General Assembly [Re: Robin]
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho

Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13321
Loc: NH, USA
Jobeluan,

I would like to make a few comments concerning your response, especially since you evoked the name of one of my "heroes" as a basis for your opinion(s). grin

1. Whether Dr. Gerstner's decision to remain in an apostate denomination was prudent or not can be debated. Personally, I believe he erred in staying as long as he did. Martin Luther had no intention of leaving the Roman State Church, but rather to reform it. He soon learned that was not going to happen and was both forced to leave and voluntarily left. Secondly, Dr. Gerstner, with whom I have had the privilege of speaking with at length on several occasions, cannot be upheld as an example for the average church member in regard to making a decision to remain or leave a denomination. He was Professor of Church History at Pittsburg Xenia Seminary and thus not subject to the preaching and/or teaching of the Liberals who dominated the denomination. Contrariwise, a member of a church whose leadership is preaching/teaching heresy is subject to them on at least a weekly basis. Dr. Gerstner was a man of influence, which R.C. Sproul, Sr. can testify, for it was Dr. Gerstner who 'dragged' him into his office and informed him of what was going on in that school and to prepare himself for a rough road should he choose to stay. Sproul has many humorous stories he loves to relate concerning his stay at Pittsburg Xenia and the relationship which developed between himself and Dr. Gerstner. Bottom line... the regular church member is NOT to submit himself/herself to the authority and teaching of a heretical elder/pastor.

2. I remember well, having been there personally, the vote cast at Tenth Presbyterian Church in Philadelphia, on the issue of leaving the PCUSA. It was a unanimous vote by the eldership and the membership to leave. They were surely justified in departing that heretical denomination to which the church had to submit according to denominational judgments and doctrine. They could not do so without denying Christ and the will of God as revealed in the Bible. Further, I was a member of 7th Reformed Church, which was affiliated with the RCA, another apostate denomination. They remained in the denomination for many years... However, they did so while refusing to comply with the 'official' denominational doctrines, which were contrary to the Three Forms of Unity, and they refused to pay the required financial "quota" to the denomination which would have been used to support the denomination's apostate schools. Rather, they sent that money to WTS in Philadelphia, which was still somewhat conservative during that time. Eventually, however, things came to a head and the church voted to withdraw from the RCA by an overwhelming majority vote.

3. I agree with you on the procedure which a member of a local church should pursue before leaving a church. If one is a member of a Presbyterian system, then it is required that an overture be made to the Session whereby the issue(s) may be discussed. If there is no satisfactory resolution, then an overture can be made to the Presbytery. Historically, rarely are the complaints of the laity successfully, when charges are made against an elder, especially in regard to doctrinal issues. But that is the way that system works and it should be followed. In an independent Congregational/Baptist setting, the process is much simpler and I believe more biblical. There, the member should meet with the Elder(s) and attempt to resolve the matter. If there is no resolution, then leaving is permitted.

Originally Posted By: Jobeluan
Our God is not distant, or away on a short vacation, or asleep, or not active in every square inch of the cosmos. “All mankind will come and bow down before him” ….. even the creators of Biologos or any unbiblical aspect of the PCA, OPC, OCRC, CREC, RBC, URC, PR, ERPC, etc.

4. This is where I MUST take serious issue with you. You are confusing God's sovereignty, aka: decretive will and providence with man's responsibility, aka: God's preceptive will; biblical mandates. God used Cyrus as His chosen servant to bring punishment upon a rebellious and sinful nation, but he did so by his own initiative and wrong motives which was a sin against God. Likewise, God is surely in full control of the apostasizing of the Church throughout history, but it is the responsibility of those who are His to defend the truth, to excommunicate those who reject it and/or its right practice, or to disassociate themselves from the local visible part of the Church when it has gone astray. God uses means to accomplish His will. There are plentiful injunctions in Scripture that believers are to have nothing to do with darkness, to remove those who preach another Gospel, to cast out heretics and profligates from the assembly. And when the leadership is guilty of such, then one is to leave and not be subject to their vain authority and teachings. A "Let go and let God" attitude is not only naďve, it is contrary to the will of God.

Secondly, how can you in good conscience lump the PCA, OPC, OCRC, CREC, RBC, URC, PR, ERPC together as if they were on equal footing? scold Never mind the vast differences in doctrine among them, they can hardly be seen as equals in that the PCA, OPC and URC, for example began as conservative denominations. The CREC, however, was founded upon a damnable heretical basis, i.e., a denial of Sola Fide; justification by faith alone in Christ Alone as formulated by all the Protestant Confessions which came out of the Reformation. If someone is part of that denomination (CREC) then they should leave. It is true, however, that the CREC does not have a Presbyterian form of government but rather it is more 'advisory' in nature, thus there is no requirement to embrace FV, paedocommunion, and other heretical doctrines to be a member. Prudence, in my opinion, would strongly suggest that it would not be in the best interest of any local church to be associated with this apostate organization/denomination. This would be equally true of the EPC and such denominations.

Again, there is a significance difference between the actions to be considered for Elders/Deacons and lay members. As long as the local church leadership holds to sound doctrine and practice, then a member should in most cases remain. But if the leadership is preaching/teaching heretical doctrine and refuses to repent of those views after several confrontations, then the member is obligated to remove himself/herself from that assembly.
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Is man required to "choose" in order to be saved? 415186
...The people miscalled Antinomians ? 335503
Westminster Larger Catechism 303106
The importance of going to church 247282
Roman Catholicism and salvation 230426
Double predestination 216495
"Christ died in a general way for all."? 205117
Gospel truth 177362
Creation 161359
Continuity in Old and NT 128481