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ReformedDisciple
ReformedDisciple
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Favour Please #52806
Sun Dec 25, 2016 12:19 AM
Sun Dec 25, 2016 12:19 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,524
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline OP
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Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Hi
Can you do me a favour and watch a fairly short You Tube video; that is claiming some ridiculous things. I would not ask you to do this, but unfortunately it is pulling the wool over the eyes of people I care about. The person in the video, is trying to attack the KJV of the Bible, saying silly things like when the KJV uses the words “very Lord”, it is an attack on the deity of Christ. Saying Christ is “The Lord, not “very Lord”. Also when the KJV says “The Lord’s Christ”, it is blasphemous because Jesus is Lord, not the Lord’s Christ.” (sorry I missed the Scripture verses in question.)
I am attempting to show my old friend how silly this is, but it seems so far he believes I am the one being deceived. As you know, I am no KJV only person, but one does not need to be to see how silly this is.
To make matter worse, this has to do with something called the Mandela Effect.
Sorry to put you through this, but I hope you understand where I am coming from.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=prfJtRLQ4UY

Just adding something else, the plot thickens. It is also attack on the inerrancy of Scripture. It is not just an attack on the KJV.


Merry Christmas
Tom

Last edited by Tom; Sun Dec 25, 2016 1:03 AM.
Re: Favour Please [Re: Tom] #52809
Sun Dec 25, 2016 9:58 PM
Sun Dec 25, 2016 9:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,513
NH, USA
Pilgrim Offline

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You're joking, right?

Oh, if you do a search for the phrase, "very Lord" in the KJV, it doesn't exist... same for the phrase, "The Lord's Christ". This woman's understanding of Scripture is laughable and her attempt to use a Greek Lexicon is incomprehensible. These people you care for are to be pitied for if nothing else, they evidently lack any spiritual discernment whatsoever.

Ephesians 4:14 (ASV) "that we may be no longer children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, in craftiness, after the wiles of error;"

1 Timothy 4:1-2 (ASV) "But the Spirit saith expressly, that in later times some shall fall away from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of demons, through the hypocrisy of men that speak lies, branded in their own conscience as with a hot iron;"

2 Timothy 4:3-4 (ASV) "For the time will come when they will not endure the sound doctrine; but, having itching ears, will heap to themselves teachers after their own lusts; and will turn away their ears from the truth, and turn aside unto fables."


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Re: Favour Please [Re: Tom] #52812
Mon Dec 26, 2016 3:57 PM
Mon Dec 26, 2016 3:57 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,524
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
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Tom  Offline OP
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The thing that seems to be the key things that the person says proves the Mandela Effect is the following.
From KJV, Isa. 11:8 where it uses the word [img]http://the-highway.com/Smileys/censored.gif[/img]. Which is a mystical animal depicted as a two legged dragon, with a [img]http://the-highway.com/Smileys/censored.gif[/img] head.
Other Bible versions use various forms of poisonous snakes, rather than [img]http://the-highway.com/Smileys/censored.gif[/img]. Not really sure how to answer this one, because it seems so contrary to snakes.
However, I don't have access to the original languages. It makes me wonder a few things. Why does the KJV translate this way?
Also this person seems to say that things like this prove that the doctrine of the innerrency of Scripture wrong. At best to me it might prove that KJ onlyism is flawed. There are no English translations that are inerrant. Innerrency applies to the Scriptures as originally given.

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Mon Dec 26, 2016 4:11 PM.
Re: Favour Please [Re: Tom] #52813
Mon Dec 26, 2016 6:01 PM
Mon Dec 26, 2016 6:01 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,513
NH, USA
Pilgrim Offline

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Pilgrim  Offline

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Originally Posted By: Tom
The thing that seems to be the key things that the person says proves the Mandela Effect is the following.

The Mandela Effect is a collective misremembering of a fact or event. Various theories have been proposed to explain what causes it, some more sensible than others. Sooooo, this silly woman is suggesting that the translators of the KJV and other versions which are very similar suffered from not correctly remembering what the two Hebrew words pethen (translated 'asp') and tsepha (translated '' or 'adder' ASV) meant?

Originally Posted By: Tom
From KJV, Isa. 11:8 where it uses the word . Which is a mystical animal depicted as a two legged dragon, with a head.

Why the KJV uses the word "" is definitely a question that is probably unanswerable. But what difference does it make? Any elder worth the office would be able to show that the word is a snake known to hiss and/or stick out its tongue, which would include many types of snakes, e.g., a cobra. Further, it doesn't take much research to find the meaning of the original word by most layman. But that the translators of the KJV used the word certainly doesn't offer any warrant to discredit the verity of that translation.

Originally Posted By: Tom
Also this person seems to say that things like this prove that the doctrine of the innerrency of Scripture wrong.

The doctrine of the inerrancy of the Bible does not rest upon the accuracy nor truthfulness of any translation, but upon the self-attestation of the Bible itself, i.e., it's own claim that it is the Spirit-wrought words of God written down through the instrumentality of human writers. As I indicated in my first response, this woman doesn't have a clue as to how to use reference materials and overall, her approach is to totally dismiss the inerrancy and infalliblity of Scripture itself, exalting her own worthless speculation as being reliable. Can you say, ARROGANCE three times really fast? giggle


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Re: Favour Please [Re: Pilgrim] #52814
Mon Dec 26, 2016 6:42 PM
Mon Dec 26, 2016 6:42 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,524
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline OP
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Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Pilgrim
I want to thank you for taking the time to give your take on the matter. It certainly helped me clarify my thoughts on the matter. Which is why I started this thread in the first place.
This stuff is not rocket science any Christian should be able to recognize so called "Mandela Effect" for what it is, silly heretical teaching.
One of the other things that made me scratch my head in this matter. Is when I was not getting through to this person. I invited someone who is a staunch KJV only and inerrancy advocate to participate because the issue was attacking the KJV and innerrancy.
To my consternation this person said a lot of what was said is true. (No other explanation)
Why would a KJ only advocate agree with this stuff.
Thanks
Tom

Last edited by Tom; Mon Dec 26, 2016 6:48 PM.
Re: Favour Please [Re: Tom] #53009
Tue Feb 07, 2017 11:02 AM
Tue Feb 07, 2017 11:02 AM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 441
Macomb Michigan
J
JesusFan Offline
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Macomb Michigan
There are 3 persons who make up the trinity, so the Lord Jesus could be the Crist of the father, correct?

Re: Favour Please [Re: JesusFan] #53015
Tue Feb 07, 2017 1:52 PM
Tue Feb 07, 2017 1:52 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,513
NH, USA
Pilgrim Offline

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Pilgrim  Offline

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Posts: 13,513
NH, USA
Originally Posted By: JesusFan
There are 3 persons who make up the trinity, so the Lord Jesus could be the Crist of the father, correct?

I'm not quite sure what your question is? scratchchin


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Re: Favour Please [Re: Pilgrim] #53023
Tue Feb 07, 2017 5:13 PM
Tue Feb 07, 2017 5:13 PM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 441
Macomb Michigan
J
JesusFan Offline
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JesusFan  Offline
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J
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Macomb Michigan
Thought that the OP stated that the false teacher called Jesus the Christ of God?

Re: Favour Please [Re: JesusFan] #53067
Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:03 PM
Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:03 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,524
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline OP
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Posts: 3,524
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
The Father does not need a saviour, people do. So, perhaps what they are talking is the Father sending Christ to save the elect?

Tom

Re: Favour Please [Re: Tom] #53078
Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:01 AM
Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:01 AM
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 441
Macomb Michigan
J
JesusFan Offline
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J
Joined: Jan 2017
Posts: 441
Macomb Michigan
They havean issue with Him being called the Lords Christ. correct?


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