Donations for the month of June


We have received a total of $100 in donations towards our goal of $175.


Don't want to use PayPal? Go HERE


Search

Member Spotlight
Anthony C.
Anthony C.
NJ/PA
Posts: 227
Joined: May 2016
Show All Member Profiles 
Forum Statistics
Forums30
Topics6,638
Posts51,173
Members927
Most Online373
Mar 5th, 2017
Top Posters(All Time)
Pilgrim 13,436
Tom 3,455
chestnutmare 2,915
J_Edwards 2,615
Wes 1,856
John_C 1,758
RJ_ 1,582
MarieP 1,578
gotribe 1,060
Top Posters(30 Days)
Tom 21
Pilgrim 14
John_C 3
Johan 2
Meta4 1
Recent Posts
Mexican illegal immigration into the USA
by Anthony C.. Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:32 PM
Presuppositional Debate
by Tom. Wed Jun 20, 2018 1:12 PM
Question about sermons
by Johan. Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:54 AM
Same sex atrraction sinful then what?
by Tom. Tue Jun 19, 2018 11:35 AM
TWU Denied Law School Accreditation
by Tom. Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:14 AM
Reformed Confessions of Faith and the Traditional Text
by Pilgrim. Sun Jun 17, 2018 5:43 AM
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Hop To
Particular Baptists and the Nicene Creed #54766
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:04 PM
Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:04 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
I was just going through the board archives, because I was looking for information on the subject of the eternal generation of the Son. I came upon The begotten God Heresy - Wed Feb 11 2009 01:48 PM by Anthony

Something was said in that thread that I have never heard before. Basically it was said that "Particular Baptists" believe the Nicene Creed is heresy.
I was a little shocked at this because although I concider myself a Reformed Baptist, others who hold to the LBCF 1689 are more comfortable using the term "Particular Baptist".
This is the first time however I have heard anyone in the Baptist camp say that the Nicene Creed is heresy. In fact, many times I have heard sermons that talk about the Trinity, refer to the Nicene Creed..
Of course the LBCF that was used by Anthony is the 1646/1647 confession, not the 1689. However, what Anthony said is a new one on me. Then again, I have heard some who hold to the 1646/1647 confession make the claim that it supports New Covenant Theology. Yet, I see no evidence that they are correct.

Perhaps someone could enlighten me on this?

I might add, that in calling the Nicene Creed heretical Anthony has essentially called Baptists such as CH Spurgeon heretics. https://www.ccel.org/ccel/spurgeon/sermons13.xxxviii.html

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:13 PM.
Re: Particular Baptists and the Nicene Creed [Re: Tom] #54773
Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:14 PM
Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:14 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,436
NH, USA
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho
Pilgrim  Offline

Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,436
NH, USA
I liked the following quote from Spurgeon's sermon you linked to:

Quote
If you are ever to get comfort, believe me, dear Hearer, you must receive the Doctrine of Salvation by free grace into your soul as the delight and solace of your heart, for it is the living Truth of the living God. Not by ritualism, not by good works, not by our own unaided free will are we saved, but by the Grace of God alone!

I guess Spurgeon didn't believe in salvation by 'head knowledge', nor by reading a little prayer on the back of a business card tract, nor by 'asking Jesus into your heart', or 'receiving Jesus as your personal savior', or 'making Him Lord' nor by the hearing of a false gospel. Seems that Spurgeon was not a "Tolerant Calvinist" and if he were alive and participating on this Board, then there would be not a few heated arguments with certain individuals who think along the same or similar lines as stated above. Spurgeon was a biblical, historical, soteriological REFORMED Baptist. evilgrin


[Linked Image]

simul iustus et peccator

[Linked Image]
Re: Particular Baptists and the Nicene Creed [Re: Tom] #54776
Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:46 PM
Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:46 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Yes, got to love Spurgeon! You could never accuse him of being a tolerant Calvinist. There have been issues that I disagree with Spurgeon on such as his what I believe is overly hopeful belief that every infant who dies goes straight to heaven. Yet, even with that particular belief, I know he doesn't hold to that position just because of an emotional conviction (if I can call it that); rather I believe he believed it because he was convinced Scripture taught it. By the way, a friend of mine who used to agree with me that Scripture does not speak directly about all infants going to heaven if they die; recently switched to the same understanding as Spurgeon after he had the chance to study the subject deeper. One day, I hope to sit down with him to see exactly what it was that changed his mind.

Pilgrim, would you care to comment a little more specifically on the issue I brought up in my opening post?

Thanks
Tom

Re: Particular Baptists and the Nicene Creed [Re: Tom] #54777
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:27 AM
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:27 AM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,436
NH, USA
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho
Pilgrim  Offline

Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 13,436
NH, USA
Originally Posted by Tom
Pilgrim, would you care to comment a little more specifically on the issue I brought up in my opening post?

Thanks

I"m not sure what you would like to hear from me? scratch1 Briefly, those Particular Baptists who hold that the Nicene Creed is heretical do so because they reject the language which describes the existence of the Son as the "only begotten". It is often said that those who drafted the creed embraced Platonism and consequently used that term. However, regardless of how many times one shows from Scriipture that "begotten" does not always mean, to come into existence by another, which would certainly indicate that there was a period that someone/something did not exist and thus one could not say that the person who was begotten was eternally existent, i.e., the person was created. That is essentially their argument. But Scripture uses the phrase "only begotten" in a different manner which describes a person's place, or position particularly one who is unique, special, etc. (cf. Gen 2:2,12,16; Jh 3:16,18). And/or, there are passages which speak of the Son being begotten, at first glance anyway, e.g., Ps 2:7 "I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.". But here, the passage is prophetic declaring that the Son as the Messiah has been decreed to appear as a man; the incarnation of the Son of God as Jesus of Nazareth, the God-man (cf. Jh 1:14; Acts 13:33; Heb 1:5).

The overwhelming majority of the Church throughout history which has embraced the Nicene Creed as biblical truth has always held and has written so in their own denominational confessions that God is one God and exists in three persons. And that each of these three persons, Father, Son and Holy Spirit, are God, i.e., they ALL possess the exact same attributes which includes their eternal existence. Further, anyone who disagreed with this truth was judged as a heretic and expelled, e.g., Arius. Those Particular Baptists and any others who think that "only begotten" MUST mean, "to be born from, to come from" which of necessity denies eternality are unfortunately mistaken. Their issue is with the language used and not with the actual teaching of the Nicene Creed.


[Linked Image]

simul iustus et peccator

[Linked Image]
Re: Particular Baptists and the Nicene Creed [Re: Tom] #54779
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:17 PM
Wed Feb 14, 2018 7:17 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Thanks that is very helpful.

Tom

Re: Particular Baptists and the Nicene Creed [Re: Tom] #54816
Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:00 AM
Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:00 AM
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 9
MI
Dutch Michael Offline
Plebeian
Dutch Michael  Offline
Plebeian
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 9
MI
Would they also object to one baptism for the remission of sins as teaching baptismal regeneration?


Evangelical and Reformed
Re: Particular Baptists and the Nicene Creed [Re: Dutch Michael] #54820
Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:36 PM
Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:36 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Tom  Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,455
Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Originally Posted by Dutch Michael
Would they also object to one baptism for the remission of sins as teaching baptismal regeneration?


I have no idea what they would think about that.

Tom


Who's Online Now
0 registered members (), 23 guests, and 18 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Micki Bowman, Nigel J, wischnotes, Dutch Michael, Ray
927 Registered Users
Shout Box
June
S M T W T F S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Popular Topics(Views)
769,012 Gospel truth
Page Time: 0.048s Queries: 15 (0.004s) Memory: 2.8647 MB (Peak: 3.1576 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2018-06-24 03:22:20 UTC