Welcome to the boards.

REDEE'M, v.t. [L. redimo; red, re, and emo, to obtain or purchase.]
1. To purchase back; to ransom; to liberate or rescue from captivity or bondage, or from any obligation or liability to suffer or to be forfeited, by paying an equivalent; as, to redeem prisoners or captured goods; to redeem a pledge.
2. To repurchase what has been sold; to regain possession of a thing alienated, by repaying the value of it to the possessor.
3. To rescue; to recover; to deliver from.
4. To compensate; to make amends for.
5. To free by making atonement.
6. To pay the penalty of.
7. To save.
8. To perform what has been promised; to make good by performance. He has redeemed his pledge or promise.
9. In law, to recall an estate, or to obtain the right to re-enter upon a mortgaged estate by paying to the mortgagee his principal, interest, and expenses or costs.
10. In theology, to rescue and deliver from the bondage of sin and the penalties of God's violated law, by obedience and suffering in the place of the sinner, or by doing and suffering that which is accepted in lieu of the sinner's obedience.
11. In commerce, to purchase or pay the value in specie, of any promissory note, bill or other evidence of debt, given by the state, by a company or corporation, or by an individual. The credit of a state, a banking company or individuals, is good when they can redeem all their stock, notes or bills, at par.

SALVA'TION, n. [L. salvo, to save.]
1. The act of saving; preservation from destruction, danger or great calamity.
2. Appropriately in theology, the redemption of man from the bondage of sin and liability to eternal death, and the conferring on him everlasting happiness. This is the great salvation.
3. Deliverance from enemies; victory. Exo 14.
4. Remission of sins, or saving graces. Luke 19.
5. The author of man's salvation. Psa 27.

Man could never redeem himself. In order to do so, he would need to live a perfect sinless life. That is the whole issue of why Christ did it for us. That all we need to do is accept this Work by faith. Christ did it all for us.

According to the definition above, you do not believe Christ actually redeemed or saved anybody. 7. To save. Christs death only made salvation possible. It actually secured the salvation of none, only making all men salvable. The early church dismissed this at the Council of Orange. The church has historically upheld Total Depravity, even after Christs death. Your last sentence shows you uphold some form of pelagian soteriology, which is heresy.

Man would have attained immortality as his reward. Since the first Adam failied, Christ accomplished this for mankind with His redemption through the Incarnation.

I think you are either a universalist or confused. 6. To pay the penalty of. According to your definition of redemption Christs death could not have been a vicarious sacrifice for sin. Mans reward? For what work? Surely you don't uphold a synergistic salvation.

Then dropping down to vs 19 Christ was reconciling the world to Himself. Not imputing their tresspasses or sins against them. Universal atonement. Then vs 20 shows that man must be reconciled to God. Man does this by accepting His Redemptive work by faith, repents, is baptised which is partly, the forgiveness of sins.

As shown already, your definitions of redeemed, atonement, and redemption are inaccurate. So allow me to ask a question. Was the death of Christ a vicarious sacrifice for sin?

God loved mankind. Why would He not. He created us for a very specific purpose. That purpose was lost in the fall. Redemption was necessary, so that mankind could once again be in Union with Christ.

Did Gods first plan fail? What would that say of Gods omnipotence? I have heard this belief offered at bible college. I couldn't believe God would fail.

It is Christ's established Church here on earth, the one He instituted. The Church of One Faith, One Baptism, One Lord, The Apostolic Church embodied in the Orthodox Church today.

That sure explains it. If your pastor teaches the same things you are espousing here, you need to find a new church.

Could you tell me how many different contextual meanings for world and all there are in those passages you offered? More than one and almost none are all absolutely. In fact, most alls and worlds and everybody's aren't universally inclusive. I am going to post some scriptures that show a limited scope of atonement.

Psa 55:16 As for me, I will call upon God; and the LORD shall save me.

Isa 53:12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.

Mat 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Joh 10:14-15 I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine. As the Father knoweth me, even so know I the Father: and I lay down my life for the sheep.

Tit 1:1 Paul, a servant of God, and an apostle of Jesus Christ, according to the faith of God's elect, and the acknowledging of the truth which is after godliness;

underlines mine

The real starting point for understanding Christs death is what its purpose was. That purpose could not fail.

God bless,