JoshT,<br><br><blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>[color:"blue"]The conditions of grace are not works. Prove me wrong if you think I'm lying.</font><hr></blockquote><p><br><br>What is the difference in saying that "I've met the right conditions, so I get to go to heaven" than saying "I've done the right things, so I get to go to heaven." Or I've done the correct things that I am supposed to do so I get to go to heaven. Or I've done the things that God has asked of me and based on me meeting those requirements then I get salvation. Finally, God has saved me because I have met the conditions while this other poor soul has not met the conditions, therefore my salvation is not based just upon Christ, it is now based on who met the right conditions. <br><br>All of this is the same as merits. There is no difference than meeting the right conditions and meriting something. You have simply changed the words around and instead of calling it grace and works, you call it grace and conditions. Martin Luther said that we could do this with anything. We could say that the thorn tree is a good tree and that the fruit tree is a bad tree. We can just change names and call it anything we want to. <br><br><blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>[color:"blue"]It is grace that saves, they have simply fallen from it.</font><hr></blockquote><p><br><br>For you grace is some sort of tool that you use to get right with God. If grace saves, then it is not up to the person, it is up to grace. "Oh yes grace did a whole lot for me, but if it were not for me meeting those conditions, boy oh boy I sure would be lost. Thanks a lot grace, but with my actions grace was effective." <br><br>I think the burden of proof lies with you. I would love to see logically, how meeting a condition to gain a prize is different from doing a work to merit a prize. <br><br>Sincerely,<br>Ehud<br><br><br>