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#4833 Wed Aug 20, 2003 2:48 PM
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Hi, I am new here and do believe in God's grace vs losing your salvation...but, anyway...I was talking to my dad the other day and he reminded me of 1 John where is says if you are in sin, you are not of Him. Yet, my dad can judge, go to the casino and only considers "sin" as being gay and wordly. When I read the bible, it causes me to say to God "I can't meet up to your standards God" and causes me to be so thankful that he died for me.<br><br>I just wondered what sin actually is. Is God more concerned with the heart who follows satan (calling that sin) or every single thing we do (all the time) like judging, angry, not acting in faith, lust, drinking, lying, etc.<br><br>I don't drink, not gay, but I get angry at time, judge at times, etc...but it doesn't make me think I am greater than everyone, it makes me feel like I am far from God and causes me to thank Him once again for loving this ugly self that I am.<br><br>I hope I am making any sense at all.<br><br>I would appreciate comments in easy to understand terms.<br><br>Thank you so much,<br>Wendy

#4834 Wed Aug 20, 2003 2:51 PM
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Ohhh...let me clarify following Satan...not believing in God, but believing in Satans power and not God's righteousness.<br><br>Wendy

#4835 Wed Aug 20, 2003 3:06 PM
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Wendy [img]http://www.the-highway.com/w3timages/icons/hello.gif" alt="hello" title="hello[/img]

A warm [Linked Image] to The Highway Discussion Board! grin

I thought about your question(s) and thought that perhaps simply providing a section from the Westminster Confession of Faith might do well in answering them. Let me preface this by saying that "sin" is not simply outward acts but rather it is a matter of the heart which produces sinful thoughts, words and deeds. (cf. Mark 7:20-23)
The Westminster Confession of Faith, Chapter VI
Of the Fall of Man, of Sin, and of the Punishment Thereof


I. Our first parents, being seduced by the subtlety and temptation of Satan, sinned, in eating the forbidden fruit.[1] This their sin, God was pleased, according to his wise and holy counsel, to permit, having purposed to order it to his own glory.[2]

1. Gen. 3:13; II Cor. 11:3
2. See Chapter V, Section IV

II. By this sin they fell from their original righteousness and communion with God,[3] and so became dead in sin,[4] and wholly defiled in all the parts and faculties of soul and body.[5]

3. Gen. 3:6-8; Rom. 3:23
4. Gen. 2:17; Eph. 2:1-3; see Rom. 5:12
5. Gen. 6:5; Jer. 17:9; Titus 1:15; Rom. 3:10-19

III. They being the root of all mankind, the guilt of this sin was imputed;[6] and the same death in sin, and corrupted nature, conveyed to all their posterity descending from them by ordinary generation.[7]

6. Acts. 17:26; Rom. 5:12, 15-19; I Cor. 15:21-22, 49
7. Psa. 51:5; John 3:6; Gen. 5:3; Job 15:14

IV. From this original corruption, whereby we are utterly indisposed, disabled, and made opposite to all good,[8] and wholly inclined to all evil,[9] do proceed all actual transgressions.[10]

8. Rom. 5:6; 7:18; 8:7; Col. 1:21
9. Gen. 6:5; 8:21; Rom. 3:10-12
10. Matt. 15:19; James 1:14-15; Eph. 2:2-3

V. This corruption of nature, during this life, doth remain in those that are regenerated;[11] and although it be, through Christ, pardoned, and mortified; yet both itself, and all the motions thereof, are truly and properly sin.[12]

11. Prov. 20:9; Eccl. 7:20; Rom. 7:14, 17-18, 21-23; I John 1:8, 10

12. Rom. 7:7-8, 25; Gal. 5:17

VI. Every sin, both original and actual, being a transgression of the righteous law of God, and contrary thereunto,[13] doth, in its own nature, bring guilt upon the sinner,[14] whereby he is bound over to the wrath of God,[15] and curse of the law,[16] and so made subject to death,[17] with all miseries spiritual,[18] temporal,[19] and eternal.[20]

13. I John 3:4
14. Rom. 2:15; 3:9, 19
15. Eph. 2:3
16. Gal. 3:10
17. Rom. 6:23
18. Eph. 4:18
19. Rom. 8:20; Lam. 3:39
20. Matt. 25:41; II Thess. 1:9
In His Grace,

Pilgrim


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#4836 Wed Aug 20, 2003 4:55 PM
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Welcome to the Forum, hello

In reply to:
I just wondered what sin actually is. Is God more concerned with the heart who follows satan (calling that sin) or every single thing we do (all the time) like judging, angry, not acting in faith, lust, drinking, lying, etc.

Pilgrim already answered your question, but in short ANYTHING that does not bring glory to God ALONE is sin. There are things we should be doing that we do not do (sins of omission) and things we do, but should not do (sins of commission) and it is all sin. We are FAR GREATER sinners than what we may imagine. Even our worst thoughts of our sin only barely border the immense sea of sin we are engulfed in. But, PRAISE GOD, where sin abounded, grace did much more abound.



Reformed and Always Reforming,
J_Edwards #4837 Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:42 AM
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SIN = A transgression of the divine law and an offence against God .

(Shorter Oxford English Dictionary ).


howard

#4838 Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:23 PM
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Howard,<br>so if we do many things throughout the day (not in faith) and not even thinking about God, is it Sin?

#4839 Thu Aug 21, 2003 1:57 PM
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I sin whilst sleeping ! <br><br>Taking our eyes of The Lord for one moment is of course sin but He knows the intentions of our hearts .<br><br>Personally, my conscience is pricked throughout the day when my thoughts are "straying" from The Lord. <br><br>As Christians, anything good we do in a day is the work of God and to Him goes all the Glory.<br><br>Anything that is not good , then we must take the responsibility upon ourselves and repent from that which is not good . <br><br>howard

#4840 Thu Aug 21, 2003 3:27 PM
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In reply to:
so if we do many things throughout the day (not in faith) and not even thinking about God, is it Sin?

You are actually asking two separate questions here. To the first, anything not done in faith is a sin. Simply put, if you are doing things which are contrary to the law of God, it is sin. If you do things which you think may be against God's law, i.e., against your own conscience, even that which you are doing is right, it is a sin. (cf. Romans chapter 14 but especially v. 23). I am compelled to also mention that there are some perverted individuals who would teach that it doesn't matter what you do as long as your conscience is free in it. This is blatant Antinomianism and Libertarianism. What Paul is teaching in that chapter concerns "Adiaphora", i.e., "things indifferent". These are things which are good, in and of themselves and not against the Law of God. But there are some who have erred in the scruples and deem that which the Lord has called clean, unclean (sinful), e.g., the drinking of alcohol, dancing of all kinds, all forms of card playing, movies, etc. For those "weaker Christians" to partake of any of these good things which he/she considers sinful (not in faith, i.e., knowing and believing that God has sanctioned them), would be sin.

Now, to your second question as to "not even thinking about God being sinful". It is virtually impossible that one could, never mind should be conscious and mindful of God in every moment of every day in every situation. rolleyes2 We are told that everything should be DONE to the glory of God. But we are nowhere to find a statement which would require that every individual thought must be taken up with God. We are finite beings and incapable of focusing ourselves upon more than one or possibly two things at one time. If while driving our car down the street, a young person should run out in front of our vehicle, surely our minds cannot and should not be focused upon God, but upon the task at hand; avoiding hitting the child. We may have a moment, a flash of thought as in prayer asking God to help in that situation, but doubtless our minds would be and should be totally focused upon that particular situation. So, that is but one example of which thousands, perhaps millions more could be given, e.g., doing our expected tasks as employees, doing school homework, etc., etc. Yes, it is well good that our minds gravitate toward the Lord throughout the day, giving Him thanks, asking for guidance, wisdom, blessing, etc., in whatever we do. But this is an entirely different thing than saying that our every waking and even sleeping moment should be filled with thoughts of God. grin Thus, if you are preparing breakfast for your husband and/or child(ren) and you aren't totally preoccupied with thoughts of God, this is not sin.

In His Grace,



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#4841 Thu Aug 21, 2003 8:05 PM
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Howard,<br>don't you feel like you'd be asking for forgiveness all the time though? Do you ever stop at the store and pass by a homeless person...feeding your own appetite first? I do all the time. So, is God looking at my heart, knowing I do care for that person, but am hungry? Or am I in sin? And would someone go to hell for that one sin if they didn't ask for forgiveness? I don't think so, but what do you think?

Pilgrim #4842 Thu Aug 21, 2003 8:13 PM
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Pilgrim,<br>after looking this over and over....gosh it seems as though we are sinning every minute...all the time and that we never meet up to God's standards...which I know we don't. It's so overwhelming and makes me just want to close my bible and thank God for sending Jesus. Am I making any sense?

#4843 Thu Aug 21, 2003 8:33 PM
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In reply to:
It's so overwhelming and makes me just want to close my bible and thank God for sending Jesus. Am I making any sense?

You are making perfect sense to me. grin A Christian could probably described as suffering from a "bi-polar disorder". [Linked Image] On the one hand, one who is indwelt by the Holy Spirit is given a glimpse of God's holiness (cf. Isa. 6:1-5) and also one's own heart condition. (cf. 1Tim 1:15) On the other hand, the Spirit within also testifies to the indescribable grace that has been given in Christ Jesus and rejoices in his/her justification and reconciliation being adopted into His family. (cf. Rom 5:1, 2; 8:1, 31-39; Eph 1:15-23; 1Jh 3:1).

I am of the belief that there is absolutely nothing..... NOTHING that can be thought, felt or done by the most devote saint which is not tainted with sin. Yet, where sin abounds, grace abounds all the more. Thus, out of a heart of deep gratitude, the Christian lives out his/her life, esteeming the Lord Christ as One most precious and praising God for His matchless mercy and grace to one so undeserving. joy

1 John 1:8-9 (ASV) "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and righteous to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness."

Psalms 73:25-26 (ASV) "Whom have I in heaven [but thee]? And there is none upon earth that I desire besides thee. My flesh and my heart faileth; [But] God is the strength of my heart and my portion for ever."
In His Marvelous Grace,


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Pilgrim #4844 Fri Aug 22, 2003 1:26 AM
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Pilgrim,<br>that was so beautifully said....and I like the Bipolar thing...so true. <br><br>It reminds me of Christians that think they are being so pure by being on a christian website...but wait...they want to argue about theology... when they could be praying for the lost, feeding the poor, etc....they might not be sinning, but they are tainted with sin in their pride as they think their answers are all right.<br><br>What is that verse in psalms that says "God looks down from heaven to see if there are any who want Him and there is none"

#4845 Fri Aug 22, 2003 2:05 AM
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I have a bi-polar disorder by the way.<br>One must remember that christians are IN the world but not OF the world.<br><br>Our new nature is apparent when we concern ourselves with the things of God and His Kingdom.<br><br>Throughout the christian walk , the sins of our wordly old nature are mortified (or should be ) until we die and only then will the christian be spotless . <br><br>A christian should be able to say without boasting - " I am the chief among sinners - side by side with Paul "<br><br>I believe that once a person can say this then they are well on the way to spiritual regeneration. The more we focus on The Lord and His Word , the more we discover about sin and its dire consequences.<br><br>Arminians do not understand Sin and can therefore never understand Salvation. <br><br> I used to be schizophrenic but we are all ok now !<br><br>howard

#4846 Fri Aug 22, 2003 7:58 AM
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In reply to:
What is that verse in psalms that says "God looks down from heaven to see if there are any who want Him and there is none"

I believe you are referring to Psa. 14 from which Paul expounded upon the total depravity of the human race in Romans 3:9-18.

Psalms 14:1-7 (ASV) <<For the Chief Musician. A Psalm of David.>> The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works; There is none that doeth good. Jehovah looked down from heaven upon the children of men, To see if there were any that did understand, That did seek after God. They are all gone aside; they are together become filthy; There is none that doeth good, no, not one. Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge, Who eat up my people [as] they eat bread, And call not upon Jehovah? There were they in great fear; For God is in the generation of the righteous. Ye put to shame the counsel of the poor, Because Jehovah is his refuge. Oh that the salvation of Israel were come out of Zion! When Jehovah bringeth back the captivity of his people, Then shall Jacob rejoice, [and] Israel shall be glad."
In His Grace,


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#4847 Fri Aug 22, 2003 8:02 AM
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Hello Gailmac,
I believe you are talking about Psalm 14 (also referenced in Romans 3).

In reply to:
[color:"blue"]"The fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God.' They are corrupt, they have committed abominable deeds; There is no one who does good. The LORD has looked down from heaven upon the sons of men to see if there are any who understand, who seek after God. They have all turned aside, together they have become corrupt; There is no one who does good, not even one." Psalm 14:1-3



Very true indeed.

In Him,
Chris


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