Here are a couple of mine:
From : Here I Stand
"I ask you, Martin - answer candidly and without horns- do you or do you not repudiate your books and the errors which they contain?" Archbishop of Trier, John Eck Luther replied, "Since then Your Majesty and your lordships desire a simple reply, I will answer without horns and without teeth. Unless I am convicted by Scripture and plain reason- I do not accept the authority of popes and councils, for they have contradicted each other- my conscience is captive to the Word of God. I cannot and I will not recant anything, for to go against conscience is neither right nor safe. Here I stand, I can do no other." God help me. Amen."
Diet of Worms
Three Aims of Our Salvation
"When Scripture speaks to us of our salvation it proposes to us three aims. One is that we recognize the inestimable love God has shown toward us, so that He may be glorified by us as He deserves. Another, that we hold our sin in such detestation as is proper, and that we be sufficiently ashamed to humble ourselves before the majesty of our God. The third, that we value our salvation in such a manner that it makes us forsake the world and all that pertains to this frail life, and that we be overjoyed with that inheritance which has been acquired for us at such a price."
John Calvin 1509-1564
" It is by the mixture of counterfeit religion with true, not discerned and distinguished, that the devil has had his greatest advantage against the cause and kingdom of Christ all along hitherto. It is by this means, principally, that he has prevailed against all revivings of religion that ever have been since the first founding of the Christian church"
"The Religious Affections"
Little and Secret Sins
"Say not that the sin is little, for many a man has died of a little wound; and we all know that the small end of the wedge makes way for the greater. Nor say that it is secret; a man may die of a secret stab as well as of an open wound."
Obadiah Sedgwick (1600-1658)
"Christ's Counsel To His Languishing Church
A quote of Bernard is commonly known: 'Some desire to know merely for the sake of knowing, and that is shameful curiosity. Some desire to know that they may sell their knowledge , and that too is shameful. Some desire to know for reputation's sake, and that is shameful vanity. But there are some who desire to know that they may edify others, and that is praiseworthy; and there are some who desire to know that they themselves may be edified and that is wise.'
The Reformed Pastor
To know that nothing hurts the godly, is a matter of comfort; but to be assured that all things which fall out shall co-operate for their good, that their crosses shall be turned into blessings, that showers of affliction water the withering root of their grace and make it flourish more; this may fill their hearts with joy till they run over.
God sweetens outward pain with inward peace.
The winter prepares the earth for the spring, so do afflictions sanctified prepare the soul for glory.
As the wicked are hurt by the best things, so the godly are bettered by the worst.
The secret formula of the saints: When I am in the cellar of affliction, I look for the Lord's choicest wines.
[Afflictions] are light when compared with what we really deserve. They are light when compared with the sufferings of the Lord Jesus. But perhaps their real lightness is best seen by comparing them with the weight of glory which is awaiting us.
Arthur W. Pink
No wise man can expect that.... God should diet us with a continual feast. It would neither suit with our health, nor the condition of this pilgrimage. Live, therefore, on your peace of conscience as your ordinary diet; when this is wanting, know that God appointeth you a fast for your health; and when you have a feast of high joys, feed on it and be thankful! But when they are taken from you, gape not after them as the disciples did after Christ at His ascension; but return thankfully to your ordinary diet of peace.
Chastisement is designed for our good, to promote our highest interests. Look beyond the rod to the All-wise hand that wields it!
Arthur W. Pink
My brethren, let me say, be like Christ at all times. Imitate him in "public." Most of us live in some sort of public capacity—many of us are called to work before our fellow-men every day. We are watched; our words are caught; our lives are examined—taken to pieces. The eagle-eyed, argus-eyed world observes everything we do, and sharp critics are upon us. Let us live the life of Christ in public. Let us take care that we exhibit our Master, and not ourselves--so that we can say, "It is no longer I that live, but Christ that lives in me."
We spend our years with sighing; it is a valleyof tears; but death is the funeral of all our sorrows.
Let thy hope of heaven master thy fear of death. Why shouldst thou be afraid to die, who hopest to live by dying!
Though Christians be not kept altogether from falling, yet they are kept from falling altogether.
Eternity to the godly is a day that has no sunset; eternity to the wicked is a night that has no sunrise.
Where reason cannot wade there faith may swim.
We fear men so much, because we fear God so little. One fear cures another. When man's terror scares you, turn your thoughts to the wrath of God.
Grace and glory differ very little; the one is the seed, the other is the flower; grace is glory militant, glory is grace triumphant.
As rivers, the nearer they come to the ocean whither they tend, the more they increase their waters, and speed their streams; so will grace flow more fully and freely in its near approaches to the ocean of glory.
Christ will be master of the heart, and sin must be mortified. If your life is unholy, then your heart is unchanged, and you are an unsaved person. The Savior will sanctify His people, renew them, give them a hatred of sin, and a love of holiness. The grace that does not make a man better than others is a worthless counterfeit. Christ saves His people, not IN their sins, but FROM their sins. Without holiness, no man shall see the Lord.
Prayer is not appointed for the furnishing of God with the knowledge of what we need, but it is designed as a confession to Him of our sense of the need. In this, as in everything, God's thoughts are not as ours. God requires that His gifts should be sought for. He designs to be honoured by our asking, just as He is to be thanked by us after He has bestowed His blessing.
Arthur W. Pink
Watch constantly against those things which are thought to be no temptations. The most poisonous serpents are found where the sweetest flowers grow. Cleopatra was poisoned by an asp that was brought to her in a basket of fair flowers. Sharp-edged tools, long handled, wound at last.
Here are some of my favorite quotes:
[*]"Should the Lord Jesus appear now to any of us in His majesty and glory, it would not be to our edification nor consolation. For we are not meet nor able, by the power of any light or grace that we have received, or can receive, to bear the immediate appearance and representation of them. His beloved apostle John had leaned on His bosom probably many a time in his life, in the intimate familiarities of love; but when He afterward appeared to him in His glory, "he fell at his feet as dead" (Rev. 1:17). And when He appeared to Paul, all the account he could give thereof was "that he saw a light from heaven, above the brightness of the sun"; where-upon he and all that were with him 'fell to the ground' (Acts 26:13,14)." — John Owen The Glory of Christ p. 174
[*]"All God's people, sooner or later, are brought to this point — to see that God has a 'people,' 'a peculiar people,' a people separate from the world, a people whom He has 'formed for Himself, that they should show forth His praise.' Election sooner or later, is riveted in the hearts of God's people. And a man, that lives and dies against this blessed doctrine, lives and dies in his sins; and if he dies in that enmity, he will be damned in that enmity." — J. C. Philpot
[*]"I am not permitted to let my love be so merciful as to tolerate and endure false doctrine. When faith and doctrine are concerned and endangered, neither love nor patience are in order.... when these are concerned, neither toleration nor mercy are in order, but only anger, dispute, and destruction -- to be sure, only with the Word of God as our weapon." — Martin Luther
[*]Love: "And at the end of the world, when the church of Christ shall be settled in its last, and most complete, and its eternal state, and all common gifts, such as convictions and illuminations, and all miraculous gifts, shall be eternally at an end, yet then divine love shall not fail, but shall be brought to its most glorious perfection in every individual member of the ransomed church above. Then, in every heart, that love which now seems as but a spark, shall be kindled to a bright and glowing flame, and every ransomed soul shall be as it were in a blaze of divine and holy love, and shall remain and grow in this glorious perfection and blessedness through all eternity! " — Jonathan Edwards, Charity and Its Fruits
[*]"If you find yourself loving any pleasure better than your prayers, any book better than the Bible, any house better than the house of God, any table better than the Lord's table, any person better than Christ, any indulgence better than the hope of heaven - take alarm!" — Thomas Guthrie
[*]"The greatest gift the Church can give our society is a glimpse, however fleeting, of another city. But we can only do that if our worship is self-consciously, confidently, and unmistakably oriented to God. If someone wanders off the street as we pray, he should sense that there is a double Church, as Origen put it: the one that is seen and the other that is unseen. Indeed, if the visitor does not feel uncomfortable, out of place, and out of step, something is terribly wrong. The visitor should experience a little vertigo, because something is going on that is beyond his ken. Yet one would hope, as he listens to our faint voices and feeble songs, that he would also hear, if only as an echo in the distance, the thunderous sound of the heavenly host singing, 'Holy, Holy, Holy'." — Robert Louis Wilken (from an article titled "Angels and Archangels: The Worship of Heaven and Earth," and published in Antiphon: A Journal for Liturgical Renewal
[*]"All men become like the objects of their worship. Our inward character is being silently moulded by our view of God and our conception of him. Christian character is the fruit of Christian worship; pagan character the fruit of pagan religion; semi-Christian character the fruit of a half-true understanding of God. The principle holds good for us all: we become like what we worship for worse or for better. 'They that make them are like unto them' (Psa. 115:8)." — Maurice Roberts Banner of Truth[/LIST]
Mercy: Hark, don't you hear a noise?
Christiana: Yes, 'tis, as I believe a noise of music, for joy that we are here.
Mercy: Wonderful! Music in the house; music in the heart; and music also in heaven--for joy that we are here.
John Bunyan, The Pilgrim's Progress
Let us wonder: grace and justice join, and point to mercy's store;
When through grace, in Christ our trust is, justice smiles and asks no more:
He who washed us with His blood, has secured our way to God!
John Newton, Let Us Love, And Sing, And Wonder
Carlos,<br><br>I like Henry Scougal's thought:<br><br>The worth and excellency of a soul is to be measured by the object of its love.<br><br>And from Scripture, I like this from Psalm 103, from Coverdale's translation:<br><br>Praise the LORD, O my soul; * and all that is within me, praise his holy Name.<br>Praise the LORD, O my soul, * and forget not all his benefits:<br>Who forgiveth all thy sin, * and healeth all thine infirmities;<br>Who saveth thy life from destruction, * and crowneth thee with mercy and loving-kindness.<br>O praise the LORD, ye angels of his, ye that excel in strength; * ye that fulfil his commandment, and hearken unto the voice of his word.<br>O praise the LORD, all ye his hosts; * ye servants of his that do his pleasure.<br>O speak good of the LORD, all ye works of his, in all places of his dominion: * praise thou the LORD, O my soul.<br><br>Great topic! May God bless--<br><br>Theo<br><br>
Theo,<br><br>I like that Quote by Scougal too. I almost forgot about it. John piper quoted him in the Pleasures of God. Indeed it is a great quote. Great psalm too. I myself, I like psalm 119 :<br><br>33 Teach me, O Lord , to follow your decrees; <br>then I will keep them to the end. <br>34 Give me understanding, and I will keep your law <br>and obey it with all my heart. <br>35 Direct me in the path of your commands, <br>for there I find delight. <br>36 Turn my heart toward your statutes <br>and not toward selfish gain. <br>37 Turn my eyes away from worthless things; <br>preserve my life according to your word.  <br>38 Fulfill your promise to your servant, <br>so that you may be feared. <br>39 Take away the disgrace I dread, <br>for your laws are good. <br>40 How I long for your precepts! <br>Preserve my life in your righteousness. <br><br>. <br><br><br>Carlos<br>
Pilgrim,<br><br>Those are some excellent quotes, especially the ones by J. Edwards, Guthrie, and I liked Maurice Roberts' the best. I think I am going to print that one out and put in on my wall in my room, so i can ponder on it.<br><br>thanks,<br>Carlos<br><br>
Wes,<br><br>Amen to that quote from Edwards. I think Piper's book "desiring God" was based on that saying. As you can probably tell, I love to read edwards and piper.<br><br>Carlos
I liked the quotes from Spurgeon. God blessed him with such a great ability to use words. My favorite Spurgeon sayings are:
I have my own private opinion that there is no such thing as preaching Christ and Him crucified, unless we preach what nowadays is called Calvinism. It is a nickname to call it Calvinism; Calvinism is the gospel, and nothing else. I do not believe we can preach the gospel, if we do not preach justification by faith, without works; nor unless we preach the sovereignty of God in His dispensation of grace; nor unless we exalt the electing, unchangeable, eternal, immutable, conquering love of Jehovah; nor do I think we can preach the gospel, unless we base it upon the special and particular redemption of His elect and chosen people which Christ wrought out upon the cross; nor can I comprehend a gospel which lets saints fall away after they are called, and suffers the children of God to be burned in the fires of damnation after having once believed in Jesus. Such a gospel I abhor.
There is no soul living who holds more firmly to the doctrines of grace than I do, and if any man asks me whether I am ashamed to be called a Calvinist, I answer I wish to be called nothing but a Christian; but if you ask me, do I hold the doctrinal views which were held by John Calvin, I reply, I do in the main hold them, and rejoice to avow it ( C. Spurgeon).
Carlos,<br><br>Jonathan Edwards has been a great influence on many people including John Piper. In Piper's book "God's Passion for His Glory" he writes about living the vision of Jonathan Edwards. Piper says "the longer I live, the more clearly I see my dependence on those who have gone before. The more I know what others have thought, the less original my thinking appears. I am content to have it so. For, at least in the realm of truth, the ancient Preacher does not overstate the case when he says, 'There is nothing new under the sun' (Ecclesiates 1:9)." <br><br>This book also includes Edwards great work, "The End For Which God Created The World." God's ultimate end is the manifestation of His glory in the highest happiness of his creatures. I think Piper captures this vision from Edwards also in his outstanding book "The Pleasure's of God." Which is one of my favorite books.<br><br>Piper also wrote a book called "The Legacy of Sovereign Joy." This book is a testamony to God's grace in the lives of Augustine, Luther, and Calvin. This book also demonstrates how much Piper was influenced by those who have gone before. He writes, "Sovereign joy was Augustine's song of grace, and it was unprecedented. His discovery of satisfaction in God alone delivered him from a lifetime of bondage to lust and pride - and offers us the same kind of freedom."<br><br>He writes, "Sacred study and the supremacy of the Word of God was Luther's cry. Through him we come to see the outpouring of joy that flows from the Scriptures - and from knowing their Author."<br><br>Last but not least he writes, "The majesty of the Gospel so captivated Calvin that he bequeathed to us a legacy of God-entranced preaching that has resonated throughout 500 years of Christian history. Likewise, he opens our eyes to the pure delight of declaring, receiving, and acting upon the Word."<br><br>Their lives have inspired every generation of believers and should compel us to a greater passion for God.<br><br>Wes
Wes,<br><br>I definitely agree with you assesment of Edwards' influence on Piper. Thus far I have read Piper's "Desiring God", "The Pleasures of God", and "The justification of God". I can definitely see Edwards walking through his writings. I've been meaning to read edward's "The end for which God created the world". Everyone that has mentioned, really likes it. I haven't had time. Been reading John Frame's work on Open-Theism.<br><br>Praise God for those who have become before Us. <br><br>Carlos
The quotes Paul posted reminded me of a couple that I really like.<br><br>Christian: Here is a poor burdened Sinner. I come from the City of Destruction, but am going to Mount Zion, that I may be delivered from the Wrath to come; I would therefore, Sir, since I am informed that by this Gate is the Way thither, know if you are willing to let me in?<br><br>Goodwill: I am willing with all my heart, said he; and with that he opened the Gate. <br><br>John Bunyan, The Pilgrim's Progress <br>_____________________________________________<br><br><br>I also love the hymn Paul quoted from, and here is another great verse of that.<br><br>Let us love and sing and wonder,<br>Let us praise the Savior's Name!<br>He has hushed the law's loud thunder,<br>He has quenched Mount Sinai's flame.<br>He has washed us with His blood,<br>He has brought us nigh to God.<br><br>John Newton, Let Us Love and Sing and Wonder <br>_____________________________________________<br><br><br>Ponder the achievement of God. He doesn't condone our sin, nor does he compromise his standard. He doesn't ignore our rebellion, nor does he relax his demands. Rather than dismiss our sin, he assumes our sin and, incredibly, sentences himself. God's holiness is honored. Our sin is punished...and we are redeemed. God does what we cannot do so we can be what we dare not dream: perfect before God.<br><br>Max Lucado, In the Grip of Grace <br>_____________________________________________<br><br>Where the grace of God is missed, bitterness is born. But where the grace of God is embraced, forgiveness flourishes. The longer we walk in the garden, the more likely we are to smell like flowers. The more we immerse ourselves in grace, the more likely we are to give grace.<br><br>Max Lucado, In the Grip of Grace <br><br>
"Oh, God, be mine the comfort of salvation,but thine be the entire praise of it" Augustus Toplady 1740-1778
Carlos,<br>Here are a few that I have. <br> <br><blockquote>Thou has made us for thyself O Lord, and our hearts are restless until they rest in thee. <br>Augustine</blockquote> <br><br>This one is like hitting you in the face with cold water! Not very comforting, but very true.<br><blockquote>If any man thinks ill of you, do not be angry with him, for you are worse than he thinks you to be. If he charges you falsely at some point, yet be satisfied, for if he knew you better he might change the accusation and you would be no gainer for the correction. If you have your moral portrait painted and it is ugly, be satisfied, for it only needs a few blacker touches and it would be nearer to the truth. <br>C. H. Spurgeon</blockquote><br><br><blockquote>Long ago I ceased to count heads. Truth is usually in the minority in this evil world. I have faith in the Lord Jesus for myself, a faith burned into me as with a hot iron, I thank God, what I believe I shall believe, even if I believe it alone. <br>C. H. Spurgeon</blockquote><br><br><blockquote>When principles that run against your deepest convictions begin to win the day, then battle is your calling, and peace has become sin; you must at the price of dearest peace, lay your convictions bare before friend and enemy, with all the fire of your faith.<br>Abraham Kuyper</blockquote><br><br><blockquote>We ask his blessing on what we are doing, but oh how often do we seek him, himself! God, and the Lord Jesus Christ and the presence of the Spirit in our lives, that is true Christianity.<br>Martyn Lloyd-Jones</blockquote><br><br><blockquote>Whatever weakens your reason, impairs the tenderness of your conscience, obscures your sense of God, takes off your relish for spiritual things, whatever increases the authority of the body over the mind, that thing is sin to you however innocent it may seem in itself.<br>Suzanna Wesley</blockquote><br><br>Susan<br>
<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr><p>If any man thinks ill of you, do not be angry with him, for you are worse than he thinks you to be. If he charges you falsely at some point, yet be satisfied, for if he knew you better he might change the accusation and you would be no gainer for the correction. If you have your moral portrait painted and it is ugly, be satisfied, for it only needs a few blacker touches and it would be nearer to the truth. <br>C. H. Spurgeon<p><hr></blockquote><p><br><br>Susan,<br><br>Ye-e-ow. I really wish I could say Spurgeon was being "overdramatic", but unfortunately he was correct about this, as he was about so many things.<br><br>Thanks for the quotes.<br><br>Theo
I found some more good quotes on another forum. <br>Here they are.<br><br>M'Cheyne and Spurgeon<br><br>Robert Murray M'Cheyne - <br>"For every look at self, take ten looks at Christ."<br><br>"Live near to God, and all things will appear little to you in comparison with eternal realities."<br><br>"The greatest need of my people is my personal holiness."<br><br>"If I could hear Christ praying for me in the next room, I would not fear a million enemies. Yet distance makes no difference. He is praying for me."<br><br><br>Charles Haddon Spurgeon - <br><br>"I do not come into this pulpit hoping that perhaps somebody will of his own free will return to Christ. My hope lies in another quarter. I hope that my Master will lay hold of some of them and say, 'You are Mine, and you shall be Mine. I claim you for Myself.' My hope arises from the freeness of grace, and not from the freedom of the will."<br><br>"It is the will of God that saves. It is the will of man that damns. "<br><br>"Faith expects to hear the voice behind it saying, "This is the way, walk ye in it." Trusting our own judgment often means following our own whims; but faith seeks direction from infallible wisdom, and so it is led in a right way. God knows your capacity better than you do; entreat him to choose your inheritance for you. "<br><br>"It’s a good thing God chose me before I was born, because he surely would not have afterwards."
Susan,<br><br><br>Thanks for the great quotes from spurgeon and Murray M'Cheyne ...I especially the love one from spurgeon: "It’s a good thing God chose me before I was born, because he surely would not have afterwards." <br><br><br>Carlos
Here are some quotes I found at another site. All of these are posted somewhere in my house!<br><br>Grace is but glory begun, and glory is but grace perfected. Jonathan Edwards<br><br>Ah! the bridge of grace will bear your weight, brother. Thousands of big sinners have gone across that bridge, yea, tens of thousands have gone over it. I can hear their trampings now as they traverse the great arches of the bridge of salvation. They come by their thousands, by their myriads; e'er since the day when Christ first entered into His glory, they come, and yet never a stone has sprung in that mighty bridge. Some have been the chief of sinners, and some have come at the very last of their days, but the arch has never yielded beneath their weight. I will go with them trusting to the same support; it will bear me over as it has borne them. C.H. Spurgeon<br><br>Knowledge is vain and fruitless which is not reduced to practice. Matthew Henry<br><br>You have heard a great many Arminian sermons, I dare say; but you never heard an Arminian prayer--for the saints in prayer appear as one in word and deed and mind. An Arminian on his knees would pray desperately like a Calvinist. He cannot pray about free will: there is no room for it. Fancy him praying, 'Lord, I thank thee I am not like those poor presumptuous Calvinists. Lord, I was born with a glorious free-will; I was born with power by which I can turn to thee of myself; I have improved my grace. If everybody had done the same with their grace that I have, they might all have been saved. Lord, I know that thou dost not make us willing if we are not willing ourselves. John Owen<br><br>Resolved to live with all my might, while I do live. Jonathan Edwards<br><br>I was not born to be free. I was born to adore and to obey. C. S. Lewis<br><br>There is no such thing as a solitary Christian. John Wesley<br><br>I believe a very large majority of churchgoers are merely unthinking, slumbering worshipers of an unknown God. Charles H. Spurgeon<br><br>Coincidences are spiritual puns. G. K. Chesterton
When principles that run against your deepest convictions begin to win the day, battle is your calling. Peace becomes sin. You must, at the price of dearest peace, lay your convictions bare before friend and enemy with all the fire of your faith.
<br><br>Abraham Kuyper<br><br>There is no pit so deep that He is not deeper still.
<br><br>Corrie Ten Boom<br><br>
Hi Mercedes,<br><br>I liked that quote corrie Ten boom. I've never heard of the name. Who is he?<br><br>Here's some good quotes from JI packer's Introduction to John Owen's Death of Death -<br><br>"Where the Arminian says, 'I owe my election to my faith', the Calvinist says, 'I owe my faith to my election."<br><br>Where the Arminian will only say; 'I could not have gained my salvation without Calvary', the Calvinist will say, 'Christ gained my salvation for me at Calvary.<br><br>Where the Arminian, therefore, will be content to say, 'l decided for Christ', 'l made up my mind to be a Christian,' the Calvinist will wish to speak of his conversion in more theological fashion, to make plain whose work it really was:<br>Long my imprisoned spirit lay <br>Fast bound in sin and nature's night: <br>Thine eye diffused a quickening ray; <br>I woke; the dungeon flamed with light; <br>My chains fell off : my heart was free: <br>I rose, went forth, and followed thee.5<br><br><br><br><br>Carlos
First Corrie Ten Boom is a she, second she and her family risked their lives hiding Jews during WWII. She wrote a book about it called the Hiding Place where she chronicled her life during that time and when she was in a concentration camp. I think too there was a film made with the same name but not sure.
PresterJohn<br><br>thanks for the info. <br><br><br>Carlos
I'm reading a biography of Jonathan Edwards, and believe it or not, there is some good stuff in here. I came across this yesterday in my reading, and it really hit me as truth and reminded me of how much we need God in every single aspect of our lives. This is Edwards from Part 4 of his Thoughts Concerning the Present Revival.<br><br>"What a poor, blind, weak and miserable creature is man, at his best estate! We are like poor helpless sheep; the devil is too subtle for us. What is our strength! What is our wisdom! How ready are we to go astray! How easily are we drawn aside into innumerable snares, while in the mean time we are bold and confident, and doubt not but we are right and safe! We are foolish sheep in the midst of subtle serpents and cruel wolves, and do not know it. Oh how unfit are we to be left to ourselves! And how much do we stand in need of the wisdom, the power, the condescension, patience, forgiveness, and gentleness of our good Shepherd!"<br><br>Quoted from Jonathan Edwards, A New Biography by Iain H. Murray<br>
Dear RefBap,<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>[color:"blue"]I'm reading a biography of Jonathan Edwards, and believe it or not, there is some good stuff in here</font><hr></blockquote><p>Well, believe it or not...I believe it! The little of Edwards that I have read, and I hope to read more, conveys to me a tender-hearted, pastoral approach rooted in an awe of the mercy of God in Jesus Christ.<br><br>Just curious. Were you, like me, introduced to Edwards through an American Literature course taught by a public junior high school teacher with no more understanding of Christian theology than Organic Chemistry, who used as her sole excerpt--you guessed it: Sinners In The Hands Of An Angry God?
Paul,<br><br>Actually, I don't recall hearing of Jonathan Edwards until a few years ago, and I was reading some sermons. I came across one much worse than Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God, and I instantly disliked him. I still haven't reconciled how it is that "one of the most brilliant minds this country ever produced" could have written something like that. Like you, though, I am being exposed to some other things he has written besides all the morbid junk that I thought he was obsessed with. <br><br>RefBap
<br>I don't think J.E was obsessed with "morbid junk". He taught the whole counsel of God. He taught the love of God in it's sweetest form, and the Justice, HOliness, and Hell in it's most severe form. He held nothing back. I don't believe He was obsessed. Rather, He fully trusted in the sovereignty of God's word and the whole WORD of god. I don't think anyone who has the read a variety of his sermons or his 2 volume works could come that conlusion. You are probably thinking you've heard me say all this stuff before in the chat.<br><br><br>Carlos
Hi Carlos,<br><br>I'm learning that JE wrote some other stuff, but I do think some of it is morbid junk! <br><br>RefBap
In reply to:
[color:"blue"]I do think some of it is morbid junk!
Hmmm....I recall being warned thusly in a different thread:
I know you know this, but I would be really careful about getting things in context
In that light, would you mind posting a sample of Edwards' material which elicited such a response from you?
(BTW, my attempt to do the same on the other thread is still "a work in progress" as my daughter tries to contact the person who read the material we questioned.)
RefBap,<br>That was a great quote and full of wisdom. I am glad that you are finding some "good stuff" in his quotes. Maybe the reason some people don't like Edwards' writings is because they don't want to hear the truth about themselves. It isn't too flattering!
I don't really like to give this stuff much airtime, but I did bring it up, and you did ask, so here is some of what I was talking about. It's kinda long, but you won't get the full effect of how painfully morbid it is if you don't read the whole quote.
[color:red]You that have godly parents, who in this world have tenderly loved you, who were wont to look upon your welfare as their own, and were wont to be grieved for you when any thing calamitous befell you in this world, and especially were greatly concerned for the good of your souls, industriously sought, and earnestly prayed for their salvation; how will you bear to see them in the kingdom of God, crowned with glory?
Or how will you bear to see them receiving the blessed sentence, and going up with shouts and songs, to enter with Christ into the kingdom prepared for them from the foundation of the world, while you are amongst a company of devils, and are turned away with the most bitter cries, to enter into everlasting burnings, prepared for the devil and big angels? How will you bear to see your parents, who in this life had so dear an affection for you, now without any love to you, approving the sentence of condemnation, when Christ shall with indignation bid you depart, wretched, cursed creatures, into eternal burnings? how will you bear to see and hear them praising the Judge, for his justice exercised in pronouncing this sentence, and hearing it with holy joy in their countenances, and shouting forth the praises and hallelujahs of God and Christ on that account?
When they shall see what manifestations of amazement there will be in you, at the hearing of this dreadful sentence, and that every syllable of it pierces you like a thunderbolt, and sinks you into the lowest depths of horror and despair; when they shall behold you with a frighted, amazed countenance, trembling and astonished, and shall hear you groan and gnash your teeth; these things will not move them at all to pity you, but you will see them with a holy joyfulness in their countenances, and with songs in their mouths. When they shall see you turned away and beginning to enter into the great furnace, arid shall see how you shrink at it, and hear how you shriek and cry out; yet they will not be at all grieved for you, but at the same time you will hear from them renewed praises and hallelujahs for the true and righteous judgments of God, in so dealing with you.
I think that calling that "morbid junk" is being tactful. ISTM that Mr. Edwards took quite a lot of literary license in that sermon, and while he was no doubt hoping to scare some kids out of hell, he probably caused some parents who were already bound for heaven to dread it. I think his conclusions are his own, and there is lots there that I just don't see in the Bible. If you think this was taken "out of context" and have the stomach for it, you can go here and read the rest....at your own risk!
The older I get, the more I appreciate simple truth. These 3 questions from the Westminster Catechism for Young Children help me keep it simple:
Q.69 [color:blue]Why do you need Christ as a prophet?
Ans. [color:red]Because I am ignorant.
Q.70 [color:blue]Why do you need Christ as a priest?
Ans. [color:red]Because I am guilty.
Q.71 [color:blue]Why do you need Christ as a king?
Ans. [color:red]Because I am weak and helpless.
That about sums it up, doesn't it?
I have taken the entire section of Edwards' sermon which you posted, and interspersed Biblical references to every section:
In reply to:
You that have godly parents, who in this world have tenderly loved you, who were wont to look upon your welfare as their own, and were wont to be grieved for you when any thing calamitous befell you in this world, and especially were greatly concerned for the good of your souls, industriously sought, and earnestly prayed for their salvation;[/color]
Fathers, do not exasperate your children; instead, bring them up in the training and instruction of the Lord. (Ephesians 6:4)
In reply to:
how will you bear to see them in the kingdom of God, crowned with glory?
Or how will you bear to see them receiving the blessed sentence, and going up with shouts and songs, to enter with Christ into the kingdom prepared for them from the foundation of the world,
"Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world.'"(Matthew 25:34)
In reply to:
while you are amongst a company of devils, and are turned away with the most bitter cries, to enter into everlasting burnings, prepared for the devil and his angels?
"Then He will say to those on His left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels.'"
In reply to:
How will you bear to see your parents, who in this life had so dear an affection for you, now without any love to you, approving the sentence of condemnation, when Christ shall with indignation bid you depart, wretched, cursed creatures, into eternal burnings?[/color]
"Anyone who loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me;" (Matthew 10:37)
They called out in a loud voice, "How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until You judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?" (Revelation 6:11)
The One enthroned in heaven laughs; the Lord scoffs at them. Then He rebukes them in His anger and terrifies them in His wrath, saying, "I have installed My King on Zion, My holy hill." (Psalm 2:4-6)
In reply to:
how will you bear to see and hear them praising the Judge, for his justice exercised in pronouncing this sentence, and hearing it with holy joy in their countenances, and shouting forth the praises and hallelujahs of God and Christ on that account?
After this I heard what sounded like the roar of a great multitude in heaven shouting: "Hallelujah! Salvation and glory and power belong to our God, for true and just are His judgments. He has condemned the great prostitute who corrupted the earth by her adulteries. He has avenged on her the blood of His servants." And again they shouted: "Hallelujah! The smoke from her goes up for ever and ever." (Revelation 19:1-3)
In reply to:
When they shall see what manifestations of amazement there will be in you, at the hearing of this dreadful sentence, and that every syllable of it pierces you like a thunderbolt, and sinks you into the lowest depths of horror and despair; when they shall behold you with a frighted, amazed countenance, trembling and astonished, and shall hear you groan and gnash your teeth;
Surely you place them on slippery ground; you cast them down to ruin. How suddenly they are destroyed, completely swept away by terrors! (Psalm 73:18-19)
'And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.' (Matthew 25:30)
Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and every free man hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. They called to the mountains and the rocks, "Fall on us and hide us from the face of Him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?" (Revelation 6:15-17)
In reply to:
these things will not move them at all to pity you, but you will see them with a holy joyfulness in their countenances, and with songs in their mouths.
"Therefore rejoice, you heavens and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has gone down to you!" (Revelation 12:12)
In reply to:
When they shall see you turned away and beginning to enter into the great furnace, arid shall see how you shrink at it, and hear how you shriek and cry out; yet they will not be at all grieved for you, but at the same time you will hear from them renewed praises and hallelujahs for the true and righteous judgments of God, in so dealing with you.
"I am in agony in this fire." (Luke 16:24)
...if the message spoken by angels was binding, and every violation and disobedience received its just punishment, how shall we escape if we ignore such a great salvation? (Hebrews 2:2)
"You are just in these judgments, You who are and who were, the Holy One, because You have so judged; for they have drunk the blood of your saints and prophets, and You have given them blood to drink as they deserve." (Revelation 16:5-6)
Then I heard what sounded like a great multitude, like the roar of rushing waters and like loud peals of thunder, shouting: "Hallelujah! For our Lord God Almighty reigns. Let us rejoice and be glad and give Him glory! (Revelation 19:6-7)
The entire passage was soundly buttressed with Scriptural truth and heavily ornamented with Scriptural language, and was preached to people who had heard Edwards faithfully preach the entire counsel of God concerning Christ and Him crucified, and your response is:
I think that calling that "morbid junk" is being tactful.
Is it possible you are having less difficulty with Mr. Edwards than with the Holy Scripture itself?
Paul,<br><br>Most of the Edwards' quote I posted was for context, so I don't think it's all beyond Scripture. However, I do think the most morbid part was, and I don't think the verses you gave prove otherwise. <br><br>You might like to check out Ezekiel 33:11. And no, I don't think that Jonathan Edwards' words equal Scripture.<br><br>RefBap
“Lord Jesus, you are my righteousness, I am your sin.
You have taken upon Yourself what is mine and given me what is yours.
You have become what you were not so that I might become what I am not.”
“God is most glorified in us when we are most satisfied in Him…”
JOHN PIPER, Future Grace
“The important thing is to stop lying to yourself. A man who lies to himself, and believes his own lies, becomes unable to recognize truth, either in himself or in anyone else, and he ends up losing respect for himself as well as for others. When he has no respect for anyone, he can no longer love and, in order to divert himself, having no love in him he yields to his impulses, indulges in the lowest forms of pleasure, and behaves in the end like an animal, in satisfying his vices. And it all comes from lying - lying to others and to yourself.”
FYDOR DOSTOEVESKY, The Brothers Karamazov
“Common sense is not so common.” – Voltaire
“I believe our homes are to be a visible reflection of our Lord and Creator, in whose image we are made, and are to draw first of all our families and then a lost and dying world to Christ. Beauty is a very powerful drawing card for people. Who chooses to be in an ugly and dark place when they can be in a light and beautiful place? When I read Scripture it seems to me that heaven will be very beautiful with no effort spared to make it so. Am I not to do the same with my home on earth?”
Edith Schaeffer, The Hidden Art of Homemaking
(I think this is my favorite book apart from God’s Holy Word)
Shy - Sue
"Let not any conversion astonish you; be astonished, rather, that anyone should possibly remain unconverted."<br>Martyn Lloyd-Jones<br>
the quote by adams: "Read to learn, learn to practice, practice to live, and live to Praise God forever!—Thomas Adams"
is definitely a keeper.
How 'bout: carpe cervesisi
i.e., seize the beer!!
<br><br>I probably didn't spell the Latin correctly (check with Pilgrim for that).<br>Blessings,<br>LEJ
Well if you want to be polite (and if its the last dark beer in the house I say every man for himself) you would say [color:blue]Cervisiam, sodes</font color=blue> or [color:green]Unu bieron, mi petas</font color=green> in esperanto (you guys knew I had to get that in didn't you?). So Seize the Beer would probably be Carpe Cervisiam. But Latin isn't my language of choice.<br>
Then, <font face="Brush Script MT">Carpe Cervisiam
</font> it is!!
I read one yesterday that I really like. It was in Brother Andrew's book The Calling. He did not give the original source.<br><br><span style="background-color:yellow;">Man must be either challenged or he must be entertained.</span><br><br>Right on the mark. Unfortunately we have settled for entertainment all too often.
In reference to your terse comments, you will no doubt appreciate these two little quips from Charles Spurgeon:No CompromiseFeeding Sheep or Amusing Goats
In His Grace,
"The various elements of truth stand in perpetual antithesis, some times requiring that we believe apparent opposites until that day when we shall see as we are seen, then we will discover that the contradictions were not in truth, but in our own sin damaged minds." <br> A. W.Tozer<br><br>I'm quoting from memory, but believe that is accurate.
Fabulous thread!! I haven't time to read it through completely right now, but I'll be back to do so -- it's just about pure gold!
Thanks Carlos for starting it, and thanks to all you contributors; I hope to contribute something myself withing the next 24 hours. God bless! <br><br>in Christ,<br>Gilda
I love them, Pilgrim. This is becoming a real battle that will certainly get worse before it gets better. <br><br>There is a great, godly woman in our congregation who points out that we are to work out or salvation with fear and trembling. However, it seems that everything we do involves laughing and joking. She went on to describe a well-known Spanish-language preacher in our area as "Espuma y nada mas. (Just foam/lather and nothing more)". For those of you not familiar with Latin-American literature, that quote is taken from the title of a well-known short story by Columbian writer Hernando Téllez.<br><br>
In reply to:
[color:"blue"]... some times requiring that we believe apparent opposites...
Leave it to good ole A.W. to give us a great definition of insanity.
Gilda,<br><br>I'm glad you liked it. I, myself, have been blessed by the many quotes that everyone has posted. The one by Thomas boston that Gotribe uses has really gripped my heart. <br><br><br>In Christ alone,<br>Carlos
He's my man-------"apparent"--don't skid past that phrase
I know what you mean. But, why would anyone believe even an "apparent" contradiction unless he were insane?<br><br>I would add further, and this might stimulate some discussion, that the Bible contains no contradictions, even apparent, and no antinomies (which is just a nice way of saying "contradiction").<br><br>I'm afraid your "man," A.W., is confused. Sorry.<br><br>Blessings,<br>LEJ
Gee, it's nice to know that there are no "apparent" ones--We have just eliminated the Calvinism, Arminian, Baptist, Charismatic etc etc understandings, and there will be no more theological controverseries. <br> I had the Privilege, and I do mean privilege of hearing Tozer speak on several occassions. I have read almost everything he wrote. He is one of the few people with a Calvinist bent who let the truths therein go from his brain on into his heart. Would to God that the average Calvinist that I have met could say the same. I believe I would put RC Sproul in Tozers group.
Dear Gnarley,<br><blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>[color:"blue"]there are no "apparent" ones</font><hr></blockquote><p><br>No, I didn't write that there are no apparent contradictions. I wrote that it is insane to believe, even apparent, contradictions. What we are called to do is reconcile the apparent contradiction, knowing that the Bible contains NO contradictions, to the best of our ability. Due to the noetic effects of sin, however, we very frequently fail in our endeavors at reconciling the scriptural information that appears to be contradictory.<br><br>Blessings,<br>LEJ
I remembered reading a quote that was really good in one of Francis Schaeffer's books a long time ago. I looked a long time for it, but couldn't find it anywhere until today when my son mentioned reading it and told me where it was. It was in The God Who is There.
If I profess with the loudest voice and clearest exposition every portion of the truth of God except precisely that little point which the world and the devil are at that moment attacking, I am not confessing Christ, however boldly I may be professing Christ. Where the battle rages, there the loyalty of the soldier is proved, and to be steady on all the battlefield besides, is mere flight and disgrace if he flinches at that point.-- Martin Luther
One of, if not my favorite quote, is from Gordon Clark.
The liberals accuse the Lutherans and Calvinists of worshipping a book instead of worshipping God. Apparently they think that we genuflect to the Bible on the pulpit, and they deride us for kissing the ring of a paper pope.
Some temptations come to the industrious, but all temptations attack the idle. --Charles Spurgeon
I found this one in this month's issue of modern reformation
"God has not taken pleasure in numbers. For nothing is more magnificient in God's sight as pure doctrine, and a soul perfected in the dogmas of truth."
-Gregory of Nazianzus,
fourth century church father
I like Piper's quote “God is most glorified in us when we are most satisfied in Him…”<br>JOHN PIPER, Future Grace<br><br>It is short, to the point and memorable, which suits someone like me.<br>Tom
Ah, thank you, I liked those quotes, too.<br><br>I was going to add this quote by a less Reformed source but refrained: "You see a lot of smart guys with dumb women, but you hardly ever see a smart woman with a dumb guy." Erica Jong <br><br>Does your preference for 'short' and 'sweet' apply to women, too?<br><br><br>Sue
I really shouldn't be speaking for Tom but sometimes I just can't help but replying to a post. I do believe Tom's answer was with regard to his preference for concise and easy to understand quotes.
"Does your preference for 'short' and 'sweet' apply to women, too?"<br><br>How about if I answer that this way, my wife is about 5' 8" and most of the time I think she is sweet.<br><br>Tom
It did sound like a pick-up line, didn't it?
How about this one "The Highway's Dating Forum”?
ba ha ha - serves me right - okay - no pick - just a dorky joke<br><br><br>Corn-Ball Sue
Thats ok Sue, I have a little bit of a sense of humor.<br><br>Tom
Here's, at least, a short one that I haven't seen posted:
"We are not all Calvinists as we travel this Highway to heaven, but we shall all be Calvinists when we get there."
Loraine Boettner "The Reformed Doctrine of Predestination" 1932
A good one from Christianity and Liberalism:<br><br>But, it will be said, Christianity is a life, not a doctrine. The assertion is often made, and it has the appearance of godliness. But it is radically false, and to detect its falsity one does not even need to be a Christian.<br><br>J. Gresham machen [img]http://www.the-highway.com/w3timages/icons/readit.gif" alt="readit" title="readit[/img]
Passing on some quotes and encouragement for pastors.<br>Susan<br><br> <br>"He that can toy with his ministry and count it to be like a trade, or like any other profession, was never called of God. But he that has a charge pressing on his heart, and a woe ringing in his ear, and preaches as though he heard the cries of hell behind him, and saw his God looking down on him--oh, how that man entreats the Lord that his hearers may not hear in vain!"<br>(Charles H. Spurgeon) <br><br>"I always say to young fellows who consult me about the ministry, 'Don't be a minister if you can help it,' because if the man can help it, God never called him. But if he cannot help it, and he must preach or die, then he is the man." (Charles H. Spurgeon) <br><br><br>
"Sin bribes the judgment, intoxicates the will, and perverts the memory. Like a sea which comes up and floods a continent, penetrating every valley, deluging every plain, and invading every mountain, so has sin penetrated our entire nature." Spurgeon
He that cannot forgive others, breaks the bridge over which he himself must pass if he would ever reach heaven; for everyone has need to be forgiven. <br><br> <br><br>Lord Herbert
Here's another spurgeon quote that I like very much, although it is a little lengthy.
"At the very announcement of the text some will be ready to say, “Why preach upon so profound a doctrine as election?” I answer, because it is in God’s word, and whatever is in the Word of God is to be preached. But you will say, “But some truths ought to be kept back from the people, lest they would make improper use of it.” That is Roman Catholic doctrine, it was on that very theory that the priests kept the Bible from the people, they did not give it to them lest they should misuse it. “But aren’t some doctrines dangerous?” Not if they are true and correctly handled. Truth is never dangerous, it is error and silence that are filled with peril. “But don’t men abuse the doctrine of grace?” I grant you that they do; but if we destroyed everything that men misuse, we would have nothing left. Are there to be no ropes because some fools will hang themselves? Likewise, must all knives be discarded and denounced, because there are some who will use dangerous weapons for the destruction of their adversaries? Certainly not. Besides all this, remember that men do read the Scriptures and think about these doctrines, and therefore often make mistakes about them; who then will set them right if we, who preach the Word, hold our tongues about the matter?...That, my friends, was my preface, and not in any way an apology. I have no need to offer any apology for speaking the truth."
"I wouldn't want to ruin my education by going to school" Mark Twain I think
My Two Favorite quotes<br>"God is most glorified in me when I am most satisfied in Him." John Piper "Desiring God" you can read it for free at www.desiringgod.org
under the online books link inside the library. <br><br>"Let the words of my mouth and the meditation of my heart be acceptable in your sight, O Lord, my strength, and redeemer." Psalm 19:14
"For every one look at self take ten looks at Christ" M'Cheyne<br><br><br>"As God did not at first choose you because you were so high, He will not forsake you because you are so low." Flavel<br><br><br>"Adversity is the diamond dust heaven polishes it's jewels with." Robert Leighton
I personally think Jonathan Edwards is wonderful and I do believe that you can find nuggets in all of his writings.<br><br>Have you read his book, "Charity and It's Fruit"? By far the best on christian charity.
Hi Linda,<br><br>Unfortunately, Refbap is no longer on the board. <br>I, and serveral others, did try to show her about the "nuggets" in his writings, but she would not have it due to Edward's writings on Hell.<br><br><br>In Christ,<br>Carlos
"If you take any one doctrine to far it explodes" unknown<br>"There are things I will fight about, fuss about, or die for" concerning the faith
I wanted to add this quote here too.
“Herein lies the safety of all believers and all churches, namely, to keep themselves steadfastly in the complete revelation of divine truth in the Word of God. Let men pretend what they will, and bluster what they please, in an adherence unto this principle we are safe; and if we depart from it, we shall be carried about though innumerable uncertainties unto ruin.”
John Owen, Hebrews 13:9
It would have to be Revelation Chapter Four verse 11 .<br><br><br><br>Humanly speaking , I love Mr Cromwells quote below
Thanks from that quote from Owen wherein he seems to echo Pauls words to the Ephesian elders:
"Wherefore I take you to record this day, that I am pure from the blood of all men.
For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God." Acts 20:26 & 27