speratus said: The situation described by ELECT appears to be a betrothed couple where the wedding has not yet taken place, "He is committed to my sister and his child but they are not yet married."
If you agreed with Paul, you would not suggest that a betrothed Christian should break an engagement to a non-Christian in clear violation of scripture. . . . etc., etc., ad nauseam
You are assuming that "committed" is synonymous with betrothal, which has not been established. One could rightly take ELECT's statement to mean that the man has feelings for his sister and accepts responsibility for the pregnancy and the welfare of the woman.
His statement was ambiguous which is why I said "appears".
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Pilgrim said Secondly, you still are maintaining that if a Christian oaths to do that which is sinful, they are under divine and irreversible obligation to follow through with whatever it was they vowed. This is clearly indefensible biblically. All men, but particularly professing Christians are to repent of all sin which includes any intent to commit sin. (cf. Matt 5:27ff) Vowing betrothal to marry a non-Christian is without question a sin and must be repented of. (2Cor 6:14ff) Unless you can supply biblical evidence to the contrary, you are therefore espousing error of which you must repent. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
The betrothal completed the action of becoming husband and wife (Deut. 22:24). The marriage rite is the public confirmation of a union that has already occurred. In the eyes of God, the betrothed couple are husband and wife (e.g., Joseph purposes to divorce Mary quietly so that she would not be stoned for adultery, Matt. 1:19).
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Pilgrim states I have already written in my other reply to you that even IF there is a commitment to marry between these two people, Paul in 2Cor 6:14ff makes it clear that such unions are sinful and should not take place.
2 Cor. 6:14 is not applicable. Making the union was sinful. Dishonoring a union previously made is also sinful (Ex. 20:14).
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Pilgrim statesFurther, the Lord Christ would contradict your erroneous interpretation and/or application of the texts you quoted as seen here:
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John 4:16-18 (ASV) Jesus saith unto her, Go, call thy husband, and come hither. The woman answered and said unto him, I have no husband. Jesus saith unto her, Thou saidst well, I have no husband: for thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: this hast thou said truly.
What we see here is a woman who is living with a man out of wedlock of whom the Lord says is NOT HER HUSBAND. Thus He did not consider the woman to be married to this man. The situation described in this passage transcends a verbal commitment/intent to marry. Thus if the Lord Christ did not consider the woman to be married to one with whom she was cohabiting, how much less is one to be considered married of they simply vow to become married.
Not applicable. Jesus says nothing of any betrothal between her and the man.
