Donations for the month of July


We have received a total of $50 in donations towards our goal of $175.


Don't want to use PayPal? Go HERE


Search

Featured Member
Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13305
Forum Stats
775 Members
30 Forums
5852 Topics
47086 Posts

Max Online: 41 @ Saturday, June 30, 2012 7:54 AM
Top Posters
Pilgrim 13305
J_Edwards 4843
Tom 3868
Wes 3553
chestnutmare 2458
CovenantInBlood 2375
MarieP 2311
RJ_ 2288
John_C 1898
gotribe 1767
Top Posters (30 Days)
Pilgrim 22
chestnutmare 19
Tom 12
John_C 9
Robin 6
ATulipNotADaisy 2
Johan 1
Recent Posts
James, again
by Pilgrim
Saturday, July 19, 2014 8:37 PM
God's Way of Holiness
by chestnutmare
Thursday, July 17, 2014 11:08 AM
Church of England
by Pilgrim
Tuesday, July 15, 2014 5:37 AM
Chosen to Salvation
by chestnutmare
Monday, July 14, 2014 8:29 PM
The Word of God
by chestnutmare
Wednesday, July 9, 2014 5:14 PM
Christian Mysticism
by Pilgrim
Tuesday, July 8, 2014 3:04 PM
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
Hop to:
#49062 - Thursday, August 23, 2012 12:06 AM Small Increments of Change
Tom Offline
Needs to get a Life

Registered: Sunday, April 8, 2001
Posts: 3868
Loc: Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
I found an interesting article that I thought was worth sharing.
You can read this article here.

Not fully sure if I agree with it, but it sure makes me think. It seems to be the method William Wilberforce used to eventually have slavery abolished.
But does the method make one compromise what they believe and is it more pragamatism than faith?

Tom


Edited by Tom (Thursday, August 23, 2012 12:13 AM)

Top
#49063 - Thursday, August 23, 2012 5:17 AM Re: Small Increments of Change [Re: Tom]
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho

Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13305
Loc: NH, USA
Originally Posted By: Tom
I found an interesting article that I thought was worth sharing.
You can read this article here.

Not fully sure if I agree with it, but it sure makes me think. It seems to be the method William Wilberforce used to eventually have slavery abolished.
But does the method make one compromise what they believe and is it more pragmatism than faith?

I think this is one of those things that it would actually be beneficial to ask, "What would Jesus do?" In fact, one probably should ask, "What would Paul, John or Peter do?"

What I read in Scripture is men standing unwaveringly on principle; God's revealed will. Thousands suffered ridicule, incarceration, torture and even death rather than compromise their faith. Does voting for a bill which clearly violates God's law something a true Christian may do? I stand with those who say, "No!" nono Not only is it true that God's law cannot be compromised, but if one wishes to look at the pragmatic side, what does this convey to an unbelieving world about the Christian religion? Doesn't this send out a clear message that there are no absolutes even for Christians? Thus, anything goes given the right situation; aka: Situation Ethics.

I don't know anything about William Wilberforce's alleged "faith", i.e., whether he was genuinely converted or not. But from his pragmatic approach to resolving difficult problems the nation faced, it doesn't speak well of his professed commitment to the one true Living God and His Word, the final rule of faith and practice. In short, the message he conveyed to me is that Christians can be bought, because the end justifies the means.
_________________________


simul iustus et peccator


Top
#49064 - Friday, August 24, 2012 12:30 AM Re: Small Increments of Change [Re: Pilgrim]
Tom Offline
Needs to get a Life

Registered: Sunday, April 8, 2001
Posts: 3868
Loc: Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
Pilgrim

By your answers, I see that I was right to have my doubts concerning this.
Small increments in this case may seem wise on the serface; however the focus is all wrong. The focus is on man, rather than God and His objective Word.
While sometimes results can be positive while relying on "small increments of change". Never the less, even if we don't get the results we want. In the end, when we obey God's revealed will, we are God pleasers, rather than man pleasers.

Thank you

Tom

Top
#49065 - Friday, August 24, 2012 5:43 AM Re: Small Increments of Change [Re: Tom]
chestnutmare Online   content



Registered: Monday, September 8, 2003
Posts: 2458
Loc: NH
I must admit that my opinion of Wilberforce is influenced by the movie "Amazing Grace" and so I am thankful for his efforts to have slavery abolished.

I also think that we are called to obey God and not man so indeed it would be difficult for a Christian to be a politician. When I think of ungodly demands being place upon believers, Daniel comes to mind. He refused to bow down, or make any show of compliance with King Nebuchadnezzar's sinful demands. Instead he obeyed God and incurred the consequences, as did Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-nego.

Its my opinion that a Christian really should not favor any form of abortion because of God's commands not even a compromise that may possibly allow for greater restrictions in the future. There can be no compromise where God's will is so clearly expressed. Thou shalt not kill.
_________________________
The Chestnut Mare
All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by frost.
- - - -JRR Tolkien "Lord of the Rings"

Top
#49067 - Friday, August 24, 2012 8:31 PM Re: Small Increments of Change [Re: chestnutmare]
Tom Offline
Needs to get a Life

Registered: Sunday, April 8, 2001
Posts: 3868
Loc: Kelowna, British Columbia, Can...
One of the things I don't want to do is judge Wilberforce. It could be that like all of us, this was an area that he was blind in.
In my own life, looking back I have had to change my thinking on certain issues as more light was shed on the issue. Some of those issues were very hard to change because they came at the expense of Christians and pastors whom I have a lot of respect for. Yet I knew that I answer to God not them despite what they might think of me as a result.
For instance, I turned away from Pentecostalism and some family members think I have backslidden as a result.
The same thing happened when I embraced Reformed theology.

Looking back at the article and the comments that followed, what I noticed from many of the people who agreed with the article, were people whom I know who are Reformed and normally I agree with.

Tom

Top
#49068 - Saturday, August 25, 2012 4:56 AM Re: Small Increments of Change [Re: Tom]
Pilgrim Offline

Head Honcho

Registered: Tuesday, April 3, 2001
Posts: 13305
Loc: NH, USA
Perhaps Packer's article on Situation Ethics would be helpful to further understanding why compromise on moral issues is not only a bad choice but a sin. scratchchin
_________________________


simul iustus et peccator


Top



Who's Online
1 registered (chestnutmare), 21 Guests and 0 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
cptrpilt, Rain S, Van Parunak, croatankid, Ken
774 Registered Users
Shout Box

July
Su M Tu W Th F Sa
1 2 3 4 5
6 7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18 19
20 21 22 23 24 25 26
27 28 29 30 31
Today's Birthdays
Persuaded
(Views)Popular Topics
Is man required to "choose" in order to be saved? 381308
...The people miscalled Antinomians ? 313567
Westminster Larger Catechism 284138
The importance of going to church 239361
Roman Catholicism and salvation 216323
Double predestination 199891
"Christ died in a general way for all."? 193239
Gospel truth 165532
Creation 151080
Continuity in Old and NT 117887