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Tom
Kelowna, British Columbia, Canada
Posts: 4,893
Joined: April 2001
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Most Online4,295 Yesterday at 09:40 PM
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 15,027 Likes: 274
Head Honcho
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Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
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Paul, I can affirm that there are Christians who are "locked in a box", i.e., they have basically cloistered themselves by avoiding as much direct contact with non-Christians as they are able, particularly in the area of bringing the Gospel to them. To love the poor, for example, is to feed and clothe them. To love sinners is to speak to them openly about their need of a radical transformation (regeneration) and to be reconciled to God by repentance and faith in the Lord Christ. However, I must reject the manner in which it was said this should be done. What I perceived is but another example of bad theology results in bad practice. Let me illustrate what my objection is by quoting a brief portion of the Pastor's personal letter to the homosexual who wrote him: In other words, we believe God says to all people: "I invite you to come to me just as you are, because I love you. But don't expect to stay as you are, for I want to transform you more and more to be like my Son Jesus." That's why we believe God wants our church to be a grace-giving community that accepts people where they're at while challenging them to grow in holiness.
Pastor Andrew McQuitty Irving Bible Church
First of all, God calls sinners to repentance and faith in Christ. It is not true that God loves everyone just as they are. If that were true, then there would have been no need for Christ to suffer the penalty for sin. The Scripture says that "the wrath of God is revealed against all unrighteousness" and "I hate all those who commit iniquity", etc. God's love was exhibited in the sending of His Son. And further, the love of God is shed upon all those who are in Christ Jesus. The only way anyone can be said to be loved of God is if they are in union with Christ. Yes, God loved the elect from all eternity, but as He saw them as being washed by the blood of the Saviour. Secondly, I must object to, " for I want to transform you more and more to be like my Son Jesus". If it was truly God's desire to transform each and every sinner, then all would infallibly be transformed. Whatever God desires comes to pass. (Is 46:10) What God first requires is that sinners repent of their sins and cast themselves upon Christ for the remission of their sins. It is to those who have already been "transformed" (regenerated) that God desires that they live holy lives before Him. For in that desire there is power and the infallible guarantee that it shall be done; they shall be holy. (Rom 8:30; Eph 1:4; Phil 1:6; et al). The "invitation" is extended to "all ye that labour and are heavy laden" (Matt 11:28) but not to those who have no desire for God, Christ or holiness. As you full well know, I hold to that "old fashioned Gospel" whereby the Law of God is first preached and then the grace of God as it is found in the Lord Jesus Christ. It is erroneous, because it is not found in God's Word, to indiscriminately say to everyone, "God loves you and may have a wonderful plan for your life"!!  In His Grace,
simul iustus et peccator
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Entire Thread
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A church reaches out to the world around them
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PaulRH
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Fri Feb 04, 2005 10:16 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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Pilgrim
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Fri Feb 04, 2005 11:33 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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PaulRH
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 2:10 AM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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CovenantInBlood
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 4:28 AM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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Henry
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 5:07 AM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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CovenantInBlood
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 5:15 AM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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PaulRH
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 3:41 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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Anonymous
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 6:38 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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Reformation Monk
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 7:53 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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Pilgrim
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 9:49 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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janean
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Fri Feb 18, 2005 7:49 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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CovenantInBlood
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:17 PM
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Like my teenage son says
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PaulRH
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:24 PM
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Re: Like my teenage son says
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CovenantInBlood
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:34 PM
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I tried.
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PaulRH
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 9:36 PM
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Re: I tried.
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Anonymous
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 10:11 PM
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Yep. John 8
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PaulRH
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 10:30 PM
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Re: Yep. John 8
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Anonymous
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:06 PM
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After further review the play stands
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 1:56 AM
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Re: After further review the play stands
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CovenantInBlood
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 2:31 AM
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Re: After further review the play stands
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Tom
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:09 AM
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Re: After further review the play stands
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:53 AM
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Re: I tried.
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CovenantInBlood
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 10:32 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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Anonymous
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 8:35 PM
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Ted thanks for actually engaging the letter.
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PaulRH
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Sat Feb 05, 2005 9:53 PM
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Re: Ted thanks for actually engaging the letter.
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Anonymous
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Sun Feb 06, 2005 3:38 AM
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Re: Ted thanks for actually engaging the letter.
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Reformation Monk
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Sun Feb 06, 2005 4:19 AM
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Re: Ted thanks for actually engaging the letter.
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Anonymous
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Sun Feb 06, 2005 7:40 AM
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Re: Ted thanks for actually engaging the letter.
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Pilgrim
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Sun Feb 06, 2005 4:32 PM
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Nice softball, Pilgrim . . . . . .
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Anonymous
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 1:10 AM
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Re: Nice softball, Pilgrim . . . . . .
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J_Edwards
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 11:01 AM
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Re: Your Questions, J Edwards
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Anonymous
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 2:59 PM
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Re: Your Questions, J Edwards
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J_Edwards
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 10:54 PM
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Re: Your Questions, J Edwards
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 4:15 AM
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I believe as you believe Ted
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 4:29 AM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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CovenantInBlood
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 5:39 AM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 6:36 AM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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J_Edwards
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 12:29 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 1:30 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 1:36 PM
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Sorry, my fault
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 2:41 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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J_Edwards
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 9:10 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 9:42 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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J_Edwards
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 10:17 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 12:33 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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CovenantInBlood
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 5:48 PM
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You might consider this as my response re worship
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 6:50 AM
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Re: You might consider this as my response re worship
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 12:30 PM
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Re: You might consider this as my response re wors
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 1:27 PM
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Re: You might consider this as my response re wors
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 1:33 PM
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Re: You might consider this as my response re worship
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CovenantInBlood
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 5:52 PM
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Re: the Sufficiency of God and His Word
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 5:50 AM
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Re: the Sufficiency of God and His Word
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 6:39 AM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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Anonymous
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 12:24 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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PaulRH
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 1:21 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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J_Edwards
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 10:26 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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Pilgrim
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Tue Feb 08, 2005 5:03 PM
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Re: I believe as you believe Ted
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Reformation Monk
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Thu Feb 17, 2005 12:26 AM
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Re: Nice softball, Pilgrim . . . . . .
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li0scc0
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Mon Feb 07, 2005 8:41 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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janean
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Fri Feb 18, 2005 7:16 PM
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Re: A church reaches out to the world around them
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PaulRH
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Sat Feb 19, 2005 7:07 PM
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