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Joe k said: Romans 5:10 answers your objection to justification at the cross. This is the Pauline truth. Perhaps I'm wasting my time responding to you since you are adamant about this issue and have your mind made up. But, nevertheless, there are others who are open to biblical teaching and who will benefit, perhaps, from my reply.  Let's take a brief look at the CONTEXT of Rom 5:10, upon which you feel secure in your mistaken view: Romans 5:1-2 Being therefore justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ; through whom also we have had our access by faith into this grace wherein we stand; and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God." . . . 5:9-11 "Much more then, being now justified by his blood, shall we be saved from the wrath [of God] through him. For if, while we were enemies, we were reconciled to God through the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, shall we be saved by his life; and not only so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation."
Paul begins this chapter stating the basis upon which all that follows is grounded. In fact, the first 4 chapters of the book establish what Paul says here, i.e., we are justified by faith!! It is by faith that all the blessings and benefits of grace, e.g., justification, reconciliation, adoption, sanctification and eternal life come to believing sinners. The well from which all these benefits are drawn is Jesus Christ. And faith is that which apprehends them. One must distinguish from the justification procured by Christ and the actual apprehension/application of that justification; they are not one and the same. Calvin makes this point when he writes: [color:"#0000CC"]BOOK III CHAPTER 11 SECTION 7 THE SIGNIFICANCE OF FAITH FOR JUSTIFICATION
When he objects that the power of justifying exists not in faith, considered in itself, but only as receiving Christ, I willingly admit it. For did faith justify of itself, or (as it is expressed) by its own intrinsic virtue, as it is always weak and imperfect, its efficacy would be partial, and thus our righteousness being maimed would give us only a portion of salvation. We indeed imagine nothing of the kind, but say, that, properly speaking, God alone justifies. The same thing we likewise transfer to Christ, because he was given to us for righteousness; while we compare faith to a kind of vessel, because we are incapable of receiving Christ, unless we are emptied and come with open mouth to receive his grace. Hence it follows, that we do not withdraw the power of justifying from Christ, when we hold that, previous to his righteousness, he himself is received by faith. Still, however, I admit not the tortuous figure of the sophist, that faith is Christ; as if a vessel of clay were a treasure, because gold is deposited in it. And yet this is no reason why faith, though in itself of no dignity or value, should not justify us by giving Christ; Just as such a vessel filled with coin may give wealth. I say, therefore, that faith, which is only the instrument for receiving justification, is ignorantly confounded with Christ, who is the material cause, as well as the author and minister of this great blessing. This disposes of the difficulty, viz., how the term faith is to be understood when treating of justification. To use a right illustration to make this point clearer, if that were possible, justification is akin to one making a deposit of a large sum into a bank account which is to be transferred to your own personal account at which time and only at which time you come to the bank and take possession of it by affixing your name to a document. Thus the Lord Christ has merited justification, reconciliation, adoption, etc., for the elect in His active and passive obedience which are held in "trust" until which time those for whom it belongs apprehend it by faith. It is then that the benefits are "transferrred" ( imputed) to their account and they actually can be said to possess them. Is this to suggest that there is any possibility that these benefits will never be obtained? NO!! The justification of the elect is sure since not only the end was decreed in eternity, but also the means to that end were also decreed by the immutable counsel of God. And the means by which a sinner apprehends those benefits of the cross are repentance and faith; which are all of grace. (Eph 2:8, 9) In His grace,
simul iustus et peccator
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Entire Thread
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Justification According to WCF
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Joe k
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:24 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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J_Edwards
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 4:16 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Adopted
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 4:57 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 5:24 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Adopted
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 6:20 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 7:45 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Paul_S
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 7:58 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 8:31 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Adopted
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:15 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 4:45 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Joe k
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 6:42 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Pilgrim
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 7:43 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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Joe k
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 7:51 PM
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Re: Justification According to WCF
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CovenantInBlood
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Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:03 PM
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