The Highway Forums General Discussion Theology Discussion Forum Predestination

Kathy said:

Doesn't Reformed Theology value tradition... aka Augustine. So where is the tradition of early Church Fathers on specifically this? (I haven't gotten to my reading list)... but Augustine surely did not hold this view... not from the quote presented.

Therefore I ought flint to show that the faith by which we are Christians is the gift of God if I can do that more thoroughly than I have already done in so many and so large volumes… and so we first give the beginning of our faith to God, that His supplement may also be given to us again, and whatever else we faithfully ask. [Augustine, On the Predestination of the Saints 3]

One who would do this very thing it was said by the prophet, “Thou wilt turn and quicken us;” so that not only from one who refused to believe he was made a willing believer, but, moreover, from being a persecutor, he suffered persecution in defence of that faith which he persecuted. Because it was given him by Christ “not only to believe on Him, but also to suffer for His sake.” [Augustine, On the Predestination of the Saints 4]

Man, therefore, unwilling to resist such clear testimonies as these, and yet desiring himself to have the merit of believing, compounds as it were with God to claim a portion of faith for himself, and to leave a portion for Him; and, what is still more arrogant, he takes the first portion for himself and gives the subsequent to Him; and so in that which he says belongs to both, he makes himself the first, and God the second! [Augustine, On the Predestination of the Saints 6]

For thus he says “But unto them which are called,” in order to show that there were some who were not called; knowing that there is a certain sure calling of those who are called according to God’s purpose, whom He has foreknown and predestinated before to be conformed to the image of His Son. And it was this calling he meant when he said, “Not of works, but of Him that calleth; it was said unto her, That the elder shall serve the younger.” Did he say, “Not of works, but of him that believeth”? Rather, he actually took this away from man, that he might give the whole to God. [Augustine, On the Predestination of the Saints 32]

Let us, then, understand the calling whereby they become elected,not those who are elected because they have believed, but who are elected that they may believe. For the Lord Himself also sufficiently explains this calling when He says, “Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you.” For if they had been elected because they had believed, they themselves would certainly have first chosen Him by believing in Him, so that they should deserve to be elected. But He takes away this supposition altogether when He says “Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you”… Therefore God elected believers; but He chose them that they might be so, not because they were already so. [Augustine, On the Predestination of the Saints 34]

But you see without doubt, you see with what evidence of apostolic declaration this grace is defended, in opposition to which human merits are set up, as if man should first give something for it to be recompensed to him again. Therefore God chose us in Christ before the foundation of the world, predestinating us to the adoption of children, not because we were going to be of ourselves holy and immaculate, but He chose and predestinated us that we might be so. [Augustine, On the Predestination of the Saints 37]