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Joined: Apr 2001
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Needs to get a Life
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OP
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,893 Likes: 49 |
Hi
As I previously said I had asked this pastor some questions and was hoping he would answer them. However, I am not so sure he did; from what I can see although he gave his understanding of John 1:12-13, I don't think he gave me anymore information about what he believes than what he previously did. But just in case I missed something, I thought I would post his reply to me.
"Hello Tom,
Concerning John 1:12-13, it is one of my favorite passages. Verse 13 is a further description, of those, that are described in Verse 12. Verse 12 tells us who becomes a child of God (i.e. those who received him) and verse 13 tells us, that this new birth was not based upon any human decision. But the text does not say, that the new birth precedes the receiving of Christ. One could argue that a chronology is implied in the text, but it is certainly not directly stated. My point is simply this. When the Bible talks about new birth, it says plainly that this new birth takes place through the word.
NIV James 1:18 He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we might be a kind of firstfruits of all he created.
In some way hearing the word of truth and responding to it results in new birth.
Concerning your question, yes, I see illumination (a more biblical term is “calling”) as that work of grace, given only to the elect, that causes them to no longer see the gospel as foolishness, but rather as the power of God and the wisdom of God. When God calls one of his elect to saving faith, he likens this event with his creation of light at the beginning of creation:
2 Corinthians 4:6 6 For God, who said, "Let light shine out of darkness," made his light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.
This means, that God commands that we see Jesus as he really is. Once God has enabled us to see Christ as he really is, we cannot resist obeying the gospel call. This effectual call to salvation is irresistible and cannot be rejected.
Jesus called it “unless the Father draw him”. The Greek word for “draw” is helkuo and is in the passive voice, meaning that the subject is receiving the action. Jesus tells us, that no one can come to him (in faith), unless the Father draw him. John 6 makes it clear, that the Father’s drawing is that event, that precedes and enables faith in Christ. If the word draw here is referring to regeneration, than you are right. If it is referring to God causing us to see Christ as he truly is, then it is better to view this act of the Father, through which the elect come to saving faith, as an effectual calling that results in faith, repentance and then regeneration. Either way you look at it, this is not an act of man, but solely a sovereign act of the Father, enabling his elect to see Jesus as he really is.
All I am trying to point out is that Scripture never uses the term “regeneration” or “new birth” as that act, that enables faith. But Scripture does use several times the terms calling and drawing as that work of grace, that precedes the others. I emphasize God’s effectual call to salvation as that act of God, that initiates our faith and repentance. The N.T. constantly refers to calling and election together. Try to find a passage where God’s election (choosing for salvation) appears without God’s calling being in the immediate context."
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Entire Thread
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Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Tue Jul 13, 2010 3:39 AM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Pilgrim
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Tue Jul 13, 2010 2:52 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Tue Jul 13, 2010 4:42 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Sat Aug 07, 2010 12:53 AM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Peter
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Sun Aug 08, 2010 11:24 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Pilgrim
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Sun Aug 08, 2010 11:59 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Mon Aug 09, 2010 4:59 AM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Pilgrim
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Mon Aug 09, 2010 11:13 AM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Mon Aug 09, 2010 9:11 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Thu Aug 12, 2010 9:41 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Pilgrim
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Thu Aug 12, 2010 11:11 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Fri Aug 13, 2010 11:33 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Pilgrim
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Fri Aug 13, 2010 11:51 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Sat Aug 14, 2010 2:55 AM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Pilgrim
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Sat Aug 14, 2010 2:14 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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Tom
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Sat Aug 14, 2010 3:44 PM
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Re: Regeneration Study (another e-mail)
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Tom
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Sun Aug 15, 2010 1:48 AM
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Re: Regeneration Study
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cap
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Tue Sep 14, 2010 5:28 AM
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Regeneration Study - Another E-mail
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Tom
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Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:26 AM
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Re: Regeneration Study - Another E-mail
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nvsabl
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Mon Sep 13, 2010 2:52 AM
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