The Highway Forums General Discussion Theology Discussion Forum The Piper debate and FV controversy

I wanted to mention, in addition to goldenoldie's response, and comment on another criticism of Federal Vision which the author of the article wrote:

Most assuredly, this is not a doctrine to be found in Reformed/Calvinist confessions, nor most importantly in Scripture. HOWEVER, what is found to be voiced and practiced in many... too many Reformed/Calvinist churches; mainly paedobaptist churches, is the contrived doctrine of "presumptive regeneration", pertaining to covenant children. I once interviewed a new pastor (to be) who graduated from WTS Philadelphia and studied under and was greatly influenced by Norman Shepherd (a forerunner of Federal Vision). I asked him plainly if he believed that covenant children are in need of hearing the gospel, repent and believe upon Christ for justification. He quickly responded with a resounding, "NO!" So, I followed up with the question, "Then what are covenant children to be taught?" His response was "tell them to be obedient to the covenant." Conviction of sin and guilt and being under the just wrath of God is rarely heard in the modern Reformed churches... there are exceptions of course. Methinks that any lack of assurance among covenant children is mainly due to the fact that they are unregenerate. It is not only the objective, written promises of God in Scripture which brings assurance to the elect who have been genuinely converted by the Spirit, but the Spirit Himself testifies to the true believers soul that they are children of God and have been adopted into God's kingdom. (Rom 8:16; 1Jh 5:10)