The Highway Forums General Discussion Open Forum Communion Given by LayPerson

I'm curious. What do you have to say here about communion being led by a layperson in the church? Should it just be from the pastors/elders??

Dear Janean,

I'm going to try to answer this the best that I can.

1. 58-3. It is proper that public notice should be given to the congregation, at least the Sabbath before the administration of this ordinance, and that, either then, or on some day of the week, the people be instructed in its nature, and a due preparation for it, that all may come in a suitable manner to this holy feast.

58-4. On the day of the observance of the Lord’s Supper, when the sermon is ended, the minister shall show:

a. That this is an ordinance of Christ; by reading the words of institution, either from one of the Evangelists, or from 1 Corin- thians 11, which, as to him may appear expedient, he may explain and apply;

b. That it is to be observed in remembrance of Christ, to show forth His death till He come; that it is of inestimable benefit, to strengthen His people against sin; to support them under troubles; to encourage and quicken them in duty; to inspire them with love and zeal; to increase their faith, and holy resolution; and to beget peace of conscience, and comfortable hopes of eternal life.

THE BOOK OF
CHURCH ORDER
OF THE
PRESBYTERIAN
CHURCH
IN AMERICA

It was ordained for the continual remembrance of the sacrifice of the death of Christ, and of the benefits which we thereby receive. The bread which in the Lord's Supper is broken, given, and eaten, is meant to remind us of Christ's body given on the cross for our sins. The wine which is poured out and received, is meant to remind us of Christ's blood shed on the cross for our sins. He that eats that bread and drinks that wine is reminded, in the most striking and forcible manner, of the benefits Christ has obtained for his soul, and of the death of Christ as the hinge and turning point on which all those benefits depend.

J. C. Ryle (1816-1900)

The permanent pastoral offices of ministers of the Word and Sacrament are pastors and assistant pastors. When a minister of the Word and Sacrament is called as pastor or associate pastor of a particular church or churches, she or he is to be responsible for a quality of life and relationships that commend the gospel to all persons and that communicate its joy and its justice. The pastor is responsible for studying, teaching and preaching the Word, for administering Baptism and the Lord's Supper, for praying with and for the congregation. With the elders, the pastor is to encourage the people in the worship and sevice of God; to equip and enable them for their tasks within the chruch and their mission in the world; to exercise pastoral care, devoting special attention to the poor, the sick, the troubled, and the dying; to participate in governing responsibilities, including leadership of the congregation in implementing the principles of participation and inclusiveness in the decision making of the church, and its task of reaching out in concern and service to the life of the human community as a whole.

I believe that because of the decline of church discipline, the liberal mega church and parachurch movement and the rest of the influences of our post modern era, we have lost tract of the importance of the local church. I also feel that the office of the ordained minister has been cheapened throughout the church. There seem to be preachers everywhere now days without degrees, who have not gone through seminary or any formal pastoral training and have little command of the scriptures.

I also feel that there are many churches today that simply give the pastor too many responsibilities. The pastors main duty is to administer the sacraments and to proclaim the Word. But we see churches everywhere with close to a thousand members and only one or two pastors. My question is how in the world is the pastor supposed to administer to a flock of that size?

So we find more and more attention drawn away from the main worship service and the Lords Day and placed on smaller ministry groups and functions. People would rather attend a smaller bible study, ministry program or small group where more attention can be placed on them, where they can grow and learn.

This of course ultimately leads to people wanting to hold the Lords Supper at other times and places instead of keeping it in the sanctuary on Sunday administered by those who have been called to do so. By doing this, it cheapens the meaning, it causes confusion and doubt within the body in my opinion.

So my answer is no, I do not believe that anyone other then the pastor should administer the sacraments. Of course, I’m not talking about elders or deacons going up to actually assist in handing out the elements. This is obviously essential.

Y.B.I.C,

Dave.

Why is it essential? I attended a very large church where the body and blood of Christ was distributed each Sunday by the pastor alone.

Dave that was a very reasoned response on why you don't want anyone other than pastors/elders to distribute communion. However, since I don't adhere to the RPW nor that particular book of order could you provide me scriptural reasons why a layperson shouldn't distribute communion. Thanks, and Happy Newyear.

Besides being contrary to 1 Cor. 4:1, the use of laymen may lead communicants to doubt that the body and blood of Christ are truly distributed and received. In one church growth congregation, where visitors are encouraged to join without instruction or examination, the layman said, "Take eat, this represents the body of Christ." The layman, in this case, not only changed the meaning of the words but changed the actual words of Christ to suit his Zwinglian understanding.

Could you please clarify your post???

1. I'm not all clear how this is a violation of 1 Cor. 4:1.

2. I'm also not clear what the layperson did wrong in the quote you provided? Could you please explain this more for me.

I will clarify where I am coming from on this issue. At my church it seems like "anything goes" sometimes and this includes communion. We even have one of our high school girls come up (on quite a regular basis) to lead communion for the congreation on Sunday mornings. From listening to her I don't think she has the maturity level to do this (not to mention should a woman be doing this up front on Sunday - that's another problem). Also there's another man who leads it that sometimes gives a "mini-sermon" before all take communion. It just seems to not have the seriousness that it should - that's what I discern.

Overseers are called by God (Acts 20:28) and, therefore, are not laymen. These ministers of Christ are the stewards of the mysteries. A true mystery of God is the real presence of the body and blood of Christ in Holy Communion.



Please allow me to relate my understanding of Reform thinking on Holy Supper subject to correction. The Zwinglian view is "This represents my Body." The Calvinist view is "This is my Body but only in a spiritual sense."

Opposed to these views is the Lutheran view: "This is my Body both spiritually and physically." Lutherans say the human and divine natures of Christ are inseparable and are in sacramental union with the bread and the wine.


Neither a novice nor a woman is qualified to be steward of the mysteries. 1 Tim. 3. However, if your congregation teaches that Communion is only a symbol, I don't believe you receive the body and blood of Christ. Therefore, there is no mystery of God and no violation of 1 Cor. 4:1.

The practice of the Lord's Supper should be overseen by the elders of the church, as with all things. But to say that only officers of the church may "administer" the elements is to make them into priests. The New Testament pastor is not a mediator between God and men, and the blessing of partaking in the sacrament has nothing to do with the men who distribute the elements of it.

As long as the words of institution and their meaning are not changed, the Lord has promised to be present in the Supper whether the words are spoken by priest or layman. However, scripture also teaches that the words are to be spoken and the Supper distributed by ministers whom He has specifically called for that very purpose.

What do you mean by "words of institution"? And what do you mean by "present in the Supper."




Where do you believe that this is taught? It seems to me that this doctrine makes the New Testament "minister" into a mediatorial priest.

This matter of the administration of the sacraments has already been discussed at some length back in March of this year. You an access that thread by clicking here: The Sacraments

For an extended explanation of the regulation of the worship of God in the Church, which includes the administration of the Sacraments of Baptism and the Lord's Supper, you can read a 3-part series I provided in that thread by Bannerman by clicking the link provided in one of my replies here: Bannerman.zip file

In His Grace,

I'm not interested in reading old threads or articles. I came here for discussion.

Stuart DiNenno,

That was a rather rude answer!!!!!!! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/bash.gif" alt="" />


In His Hands,

Ruth

And perhaps you find some titillation in having discussions out of ignorance rather than being informed of the subject you desire to discuss? The thread I referenced for you contains some very interesting and salient discussions on the subject in question. Further, the 3-part article I offered to you is truly a classic and one which you would doubtless benefit from, i.e., if you consider gaining knowledge of a subject to be beneficial? <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/shrug.gif" alt="" />

Lastly, I agree with Ruth, that your remark was quite rude and one that will be reserved for further discussion. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

In His Grace,

The words written by the Evangelists, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and St. Paul:



Whenever His words are spoken in an assembly of Christians (and the meaning of His words remain unchanged), Christ has promised that His body and blood will be distributed and received by those who eat the bread and drink the wine of the Supper. See my earlier comments.


I think you may be referring to "Apostolic Succession". This human tradition had a worthy origin but it has been completely subverted by the Papist and Orthodox Churches into a mediatorial class of priests, bishops and popes holding divine offices nowhere described in scripture. However, the office of minister is described in scripture and its qualifications and functions (steward of the mysteries) are clearly defined. Please refer earlier to my comments in this thread and to the thread referenced by Pilgrim.