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Rick Bates
Rick Bates
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#27667 Mon Aug 29, 2005 10:28 PM
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Peter Offline OP
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Last Sunday I had to put my dog down, she was between 14 and 17 years old depending on which senile person you asked (I said 17). And it got me wondering will there be animals in either heaven or the new creation?


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Peter #27668 Mon Aug 29, 2005 11:11 PM
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Boanerges,
Sorry to hear about your dog. What breed was she?
Anyway, while I'm sure there are more erudite treatments of this question out there, my question would be, if we expect dirt and vegetation to be in God's perfect new creation, why not "soulish" animals like dogs as well?


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Peter #27669 Tue Aug 30, 2005 12:31 PM
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Boanerges said:
Last Sunday I had to put my dog down, she was between 14 and 17 years old depending on which senile person you asked (I said 17). And it got me wondering will there be animals in either heaven or the new creation?

I doubt there'll be animals in heaven. I suppose it depends on whether animals have an immaterial and eternal soul as humans do? Yet, I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect animals in the new earth. As Brad pointed out, if we may expect vegetation, why not animals? But I don't know whether we can say from the Bible whether that will be the case; and if there will in fact be animals, I should wonder also what changes may occur in that regard—could we expect animals to be eating other animals? It's certainly an interesting question. Does anyone know of Bible passages that may apply specifically?


Kyle

I tell you, this man went down to his house justified.
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This is what I thought of immediately:

Quote
Isaiah 11:11:1 There shall come forth a shoot from the stump of Jesse,
and a branch from his roots shall bear fruit.
2 And the Spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him,
the Spirit of wisdom and understanding,
the Spirit of counsel and might,
the Spirit of knowledge and the fear of the Lord.
3 And his delight shall be in the fear of the Lord.
He shall not judge by what his eyes see,
or decide disputes by what his ears hear,
4 but with righteousness he shall judge the poor,
and decide with equity for the meek of the earth;
and he shall strike the earth with the rod of his mouth,
and with the breath of his lips he shall kill the wicked.
5 Righteousness shall be the belt of his waist,
and faithfulness the belt of his loins.
6 The wolf shall dwell with the lamb,
and the leopard shall lie down with the young goat,
and the calf and the lion and the fattened calf together;
and a little child shall lead them.
7 The cow and the bear shall graze;
their young shall lie down together;
and the lion shall eat straw like the ox.
8 The nursing child shall play over the hole of the cobra,
and the weaned child shall put his hand on the adder's den.
9 They shall not hurt or destroy
in all my holy mountain;
for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord
as the waters cover the sea.

Quote
Isaiah 65:17 “For behold, I create new heavens
and a new earth,
and the former things shall not be remembered
or come into mind.
18 But be glad and rejoice forever
in that which I create;
for behold, I create Jerusalem to be a joy,
and her people to be a gladness.
19 I will rejoice in Jerusalem
and be glad in my people;
no more shall be heard in it the sound of weeping
and the cry of distress.
20 No more shall there be in it
an infant who lives but a few days,
or an old man who does not fill out his days,
for the young man shall die a hundred years old,
and the sinner a hundred years old shall be accursed.
21 They shall build houses and inhabit them;
they shall plant vineyards and eat their fruit.
22 They shall not build and another inhabit;
they shall not plant and another eat;
for like the days of a tree shall the days of my people be,
and my chosen shall long enjoy [3] the work of their hands.
23 They shall not labor in vain
or bear children for calamity, [4]
for they shall be the offspring of the blessed of the Lord,
and their descendants with them.
24 Before they call I will answer;
while they are yet speaking I will hear.
25 The wolf and the lamb shall graze together;
the lion shall eat straw like the ox,
and dust shall be the serpent's food.
They shall not hurt or destroy
in all my holy mountain,”
says the Lord.


(Latin phrase goes here.)
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Peter Offline OP
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Sorry to hear about your dog. What breed was she?

She was a mixed breed malamute border collie.


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Peter #27672 Wed Aug 31, 2005 10:32 AM
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Boanerges, with out any doubt there will be animals in Gods new creation, the Bible tells us so. For now we have to acsept that love ones die and we are left with the pain of it. In Gods new world will be no sin and therefore no death. I am truly sorry about your dog.


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Boanerges,
As the owner of an elderly dog, I was so sorry to hear of your loss, and can well imagine how you must be feeling. I thought you might find the following comment by Matthew Henry on Romans 8:21-22, interesting.
"Sin is a burden to the whole creation; the sin of the Jews, in crucifying Christ, set the earth a quaking under them. The idols were a burden to the weary beast, Isa. xlvi. 1. There is a general outcry of the whole creation against the sin of man: the stone crieth out of the wall (Hab. ii. 11), the land cries, Job xxxi. 38. (3.) That the creature, that is now thus burdened, shall, at the time of the restitution of all things, be delivered from this bondage into the glorious liberty of the children of God (v. 21)-- they shall no more be subject to vanity and corruption, and the other fruits of the curse; but, on the contrary, this lower world shall be renewed: when there will be new heavens there will be a new earth (2 Pet. iii. 13; Rev. xxi. 1); and there shall be a glory conferred upon all the creatures, which shall be (in the proportion of their natures) as suitable and as great an advancement as the glory of the children of God shall be to them. The fire at the last day shall be a refining, not a destroying annihilating fire. What becomes of the souls of brutes, that go downwards, none can tell. But it should seem by the scripture that there will be some kind of restoration of them. And if it be objected, What use will they be of to glorified saints? we may suppose them of as much use as they were to Adam in innocency; and if it be only to illustrate the wisdom, power, and goodness of their Creator, that is enough."
Yours in Him,
Brian.

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Boanerges
I am very sorry to hear about your about your dog. I'm a cat guy and have one cool kitty.

I will try to respond to your question (half way down) not with what I think but with the Bible.
May God help me.

Animals were created by the word of God and have living souls which make them different from plants.

Ge 1:30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air,
and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life,
I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so. {life: Heb. [b][color:"FF0000"]living soul[/color]
}[/b]

I believe though that animals soul is in there blood and is not spiritual like mans so when an animal dies it returns to the earth.

Ec 3:21 Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward,
and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?


Do animals go to Heaven? No


Quote
Boanerges said:
... will there be animals in either heaven or the new creation?

[color:"0000FF"]Will there be animals in heaven?[/color] I think so for the whole creation groaneth and will partake in the final regeneration.

Eph 1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one [b][color:"FF0000"]all things[/color] in Christ, [color:"FF0000"]both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; [/color] even in him:[/b]

Re 22:3 And there shall be [color:"FF0000"]no more curse[/color] . . .

Re 21:5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold,
I make [color:"FF0000"]all things new[/color] . . .


Amen and Amen


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