The Highway Forums General Discussion Theology Discussion Forum Bargaining with God

WHy was bargaining with God an acceptable practice with OT people? THis trait has disappeared.

Any thoughts?

I'm not so sure what you mean by "acceptable", but I am going to assume you are referring, for example, to Abraham's bargaining with God (Gen 18:23-32)? Taking that one example, what I see is Abraham expressing his 1) embarrassing ignorance in regard to the reality of the depravity of mankind, 2) his love and passion for his nephew Lot and family, 3) freedom to bare his soul before God, 4) and his confidence that the Lord God is One Who is righteous and therefore will always do right; right in the sense of that which is in perfect alignment with God's own holiness.

I'm also not so sure that this "trait" has disappeared. But perhaps Christians (true Christians) today are more informed due to the fact that they have the Canon wherein God is more fully revealed. Thus, His will is better known as is the condition of men's hearts. And so, their prayers are more "refined" and in accord with the will of God, although there certainly are times that they do not know what to pray in some situations. But the Holy Spirit at such times is able to communicate the depth of the heart which a person is unable to formulate in word or even thought.

In His grace,

Many more examples than that Pilgrim. Moses squawking about his call. jacobs "If" vow. Gideon. THere are many examples. You do not see anything like this is the NT. I am not asking why they did it, but just the fact of speaking to God in such a way.

Why not read what I wrote? <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/scratch1.gif" alt="" />

I said Abraham was ONE example (implying there were others). And I did offer an explanation why such dialog isn't found among Christians today. Let me add yet another reason and that is in some of those instances, God appeared in theophanies, e.g., in the case of Abraham and Jacob, it was the pre-incarnate Christ to whom they spoke. Post Pentecost, the Holy Spirit was given universally to all true believers as opposed to singular theophanic appearances of God and thus God now dwells within on a 24/7 permanent basis.

IF you are subtlety trying to hint that "arguing with God" is 1) a legitimate form of communication with God, and/or 2) you are looking for justification for that which you practice in your own life, just come out and say so. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> And if not, then what is it you are really wanting to know or ????

In His grace,

Just a note. See Mark 7:24-30. Did not this women argue with God. But note that she wasn't arrogant or demanding as some of todays T>V> preachers.

Ron,

I'm not so sure that I would consider her dialog with the Lord Christ "bargaining" but perhaps more "persistent". In my mind, generally speaking, bargaining would be more of an "if . . . then" proposal. Being opportune in prayer is something we are definitely encouraged to do, although that doesn't include badgering the Lord for something we want. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

Pilgrim------ You are exactly right and very well said.