Donations for the month of October


We have received a total of "$50" in donations towards our goal of $175.


Don't want to use PayPal? Go HERE


Forum Search
Member Spotlight
Posts: 3,234
Joined: September 2003
Forum Statistics
Forums30
Topics7,608
Posts54,196
Members973
Most Online523
Jan 14th, 2020
Top Posters
Pilgrim 14,282
Tom 4,278
chestnutmare 3,234
J_Edwards 2,615
Wes 1,856
John_C 1,847
RJ_ 1,583
MarieP 1,579
gotribe 1,060
Top Posters(30 Days)
Pilgrim 19
Tom 15
Nahum 10
John_C 5
Recent Posts
Pasture-Land
by Pilgrim - Tue Oct 04, 2022 7:31 AM
Lucifer
by Tom - Tue Oct 04, 2022 12:00 AM
Biblical Worship: In Spirit and in Truth by A.G. Brown
by Pilgrim - Sat Oct 01, 2022 6:38 AM
Eph. 2:8-9 question
by Pilgrim - Wed Sep 28, 2022 5:28 PM
A Hymn of Worship
by Pilgrim - Mon Sep 26, 2022 6:45 AM
The Doctrines of Grace
by Tom - Fri Sep 23, 2022 12:29 AM
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Hop To
#39901 Mon Jun 09, 2008 5:25 PM
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 4
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
OP Offline
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 4
As most are aware and it shouldn't surprise anybody that I am a Credo-Baptist, however I would say that I am only about 90% (if I had to put a percentage to it) sure about my position.
Although I don't want to discuss why I am only about 90% sure of my position, I noticed something that both Credo-Baptists (Fred Malone in his book 'Baptism of Disciples Only’ among them) and Paedo-Baptist theologians have said concerning this subject.
Both say (my own words) that we must be absolutely (100 %) sure in our positions, because if we are not then we are not doing this in faith. If it is not done in faith it is sin.
If this particular sentiment is true, then I am guilty as charged, yet I am not sure if I will (this side of heaven) be fully 100 % sure of Credo-Baptism.
If I am sinning, and I sure am not doing so on purpose. For before I really began studying this issue, I thought I was 100 % sure and it was only after studying the arguments from both Credo-Baptist and Paedo-Baptist theologians arguments that my confidence in Credo-Baptism began to diminish.
In my mind however, it really did not bother me before about not being 100% sure because I now understand the subject a whole lot more than before.

I am interested in getting your thoughts on this issue.

Tom

Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,283
Likes: 45
Head Honcho
Online Content
Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,283
Likes: 45
Tom,

I have never read from either a Paedo or Credo that one had to be 100% sure of one's position else they were sinning. That sounds like an extreme position for anyone to insist upon. My advice . . . ignore them! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/igiveup.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/giggle.gif" alt="" />

[Linked Image]


[Linked Image]

simul iustus et peccator

[Linked Image]
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 70
xyz Offline
Journeyman
Offline
Journeyman
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 70
Quote
Tom said:
As most are aware and it shouldn't surprise anybody that I am a Credo-Baptist, however I would say that I am only about 90% (if I had to put a percentage to it) sure about my position.
Although I don't want to discuss why I am only about 90% sure of my position, I noticed something that both Credo-Baptists (Fred Malone in his book 'Baptism of Disciples Only’ among them) and Paedo-Baptist theologians have said concerning this subject.
Both say (my own words) that we must be absolutely (100 %) sure in our positions, because if we are not then we are not doing this in faith. If it is not done in faith it is sin.
If this particular sentiment is true, then I am guilty as charged, yet I am not sure if I will (this side of heaven) be fully 100 % sure of Credo-Baptism.
If I am sinning, and I sure am not doing so on purpose. For before I really began studying this issue, I thought I was 100 % sure and it was only after studying the arguments from both Credo-Baptist and Paedo-Baptist theologians arguments that my confidence in Credo-Baptism began to diminish.
In my mind however, it really did not bother me before about not being 100% sure because I now understand the subject a whole lot more than before.
I don't see that it makes any difference. Water baptism can be undergone by anyone, even more easily than circumcision. There are millions of people, Protestant as well as Catholic, walking around as baptised Christians, who do not know Christ, and quite often do not even know much about him. Some were baptised as adults, with little more seriousness than they would have when joining a secular group. They have no more real faith than an infant in arms has. Water baptism has become meaningless.

Speaking of infants, paedo-baptism does not necessarily exclude credo-baptism. Quite small children can commit their lives to Christ, fully aware of what they are doing.

Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 15
Plebeian
Offline
Plebeian
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 15
I would think that much of what we do is done with some percentage of uncertainty - some of it still done "in faith" and some not. Perhaps the "100%-sure theorists" are simply suggesting that to baptize or be baptized for any reason outside of acting in faithful obedience is sinful. The Word says God searches the hearts of men, so I think you can rest in that. And I think He can redeem even that which is done with less than perfect motives.

I myself have been baptized three times.... Once as an infant although neither one of my parents was walking closely with the Lord at the time. Once (sprinkled) after coming to faith in Christ at the age of 15. The third time (immersed) a year or so later at the urging of a Baptist pastor. Both of the latter times were done out of what I thought was obedience at the time. I think what is more important than either, however, is my walk with Christ since then. I have far more regrets about aspects of this and cling only to the cross so that I might stand before God someday.

Last edited by M Azingrace; Tue Jun 10, 2008 7:20 AM.

M Azingrace

[color:"blue"]...how sweet the sound[/color]
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 193
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 193
Quote
M Azingrace said:

Perhaps the "100%-sure theorists" are simply suggesting that to baptize or be baptized for any reason outside of acting in faithful obedience is sinful. The Word says God searches the hearts of men, so I think you can rest in that. And I think He can redeem even that which is done with less than perfect motives.

Amen.

Quote
M Azingrace said
I cling only to the cross so that I might stand before God someday.

Amen. Amen. Amen.


[Linked Image]
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
Old Hand
Offline
Old Hand
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
Tom since I have Malone's book direct me to the pages where you suggest he says these things. Or even suggests them.


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 4
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
OP Offline
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 4
Quote
Boanerges said:
Tom since I have Malone's book direct me to the pages where you suggest he says these things. Or even suggests them.

Ok but I will have to look for the pages, so it might be a day or two.

Tom

Tom #39908 Wed Jun 11, 2008 11:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
Old Hand
Offline
Old Hand
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
Take your time Tom I'll be looking in when I have time available.


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 4
Tom Offline OP
Needs to get a Life
OP Offline
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,279
Likes: 4
I found the page, but as I read it again I am not quite as sure if I understood him right the first time. I actually hope I did misunderstand him.
Perhaps you can read the pages and give me your take.
You can find it in the introduction on pages xxx-xxxi.

I will say this however, after reading it again it appears that Malone is assuming that the Paedo-Baptist is just basing his leaning towards Paedo-Baptism because so many great Paedo-Baptists believe it. What is not revealed is whether or not this person has this conviction based on his understanding of Scripture or not.
Malone's objection in this case, only holds up if this person is only a Paedo-Baptist because of great Paedo-Baptists. For it is equally true that there are many great Credo-Baptists past and present.

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Thu Jun 12, 2008 3:18 AM.
Tom #39910 Thu Jun 19, 2008 10:39 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
Old Hand
Offline
Old Hand
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
You know I'm glad you read the page again now it would be nice if you gave me that page number or at least the chapter that it was in so I too can read what you are reading. HMMM?


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,283
Likes: 45
Head Honcho
Online Content
Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,283
Likes: 45
Quote
Boanerges said:
You know I'm glad you read the page again now it would be nice if you gave me that page number or at least the chapter that it was in so I too can read what you are reading. HMMM?

Tom did provide the page: "You can find it in the introduction on pages xxx-xxxi." <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />


[Linked Image]

simul iustus et peccator

[Linked Image]
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
Old Hand
Offline
Old Hand
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 969
Quote
Pilgrim said:
Quote
Boanerges said:
You know I'm glad you read the page again now it would be nice if you gave me that page number or at least the chapter that it was in so I too can read what you are reading. HMMM?

Tom did provide the page: "You can find it in the introduction on pages xxx-xxxi." <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Proof once again that I blocked too many roundhouse kicks with my face.


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo

Link Copied to Clipboard
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 35 guests, and 8 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
His Unworthy Son, Nahum, TheSojourner, Larry, Nana Dadzie Jr.
973 Registered Users
ShoutChat
Comment Guidelines: Do post respectful and insightful comments. Don't flame, hate, spam.
October
S M T W T F S
1
2 3 4 5 6 7 8
9 10 11 12 13 14 15
16 17 18 19 20 21 22
23 24 25 26 27 28 29
30 31
Today's Birthdays
There are no members with birthdays on this day.
Popular Topics(Views)
1,380,338 Gospel truth