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#50212 Sun Nov 17, 2013 11:17 PM
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Peter Offline OP
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So under the assumption that most if not all are cessationist on the forum how many have seen/heard the Strange Fire sessions at Grace to You?

Second a number of years ago MacArthur made a comment regarding the millenium that stirred everyone up. Is this just more of the same with the Strange Fire or is he actually trying to make the continuists do some accounting of their position and people.


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Peter #50214 Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:17 AM
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Tom Offline
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Hi Peter
It's been a while, good to see you post again. grin
As to your questions, in my opinion it is both. MacArthur makes some excellent points concerning the continuist movement. I am not sure if you are aware of this or not, but Tim Challies did a series of interviews with Dr. MacArthur at challies.com.
In one of these interviews MacArthur actually brings the issue of the millennium up as an example of his consistencies against unbiblical teaching. To be fair he did say that the continuist issue is a lot more important that the millennial issue. However, as I was reading his good points, when he brought up the millennial issue, I wanted to stop reading right there because I think his argument for Dispensational Premillennialism are rather silly. In fact when he spoke of what Ammillenialists believe, I couldn't help thinking he didn't even understand what an Ammillenialist believes.
Tom

Last edited by Tom; Mon Nov 18, 2013 2:18 AM.
Tom #50215 Mon Nov 18, 2013 9:52 PM
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Peter Offline OP
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Hi Tom thanks for the welcome back, haven't listened to all of the messages nor have I been over to Challes. I did listen to one where Steve Lawson and Todd Friel lumped all post-millenialists with New Apostoloic Reformation. Somewhere Loraine Boettner is going "WHAT?"


Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Peter #50222 Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:46 AM
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What is New Apostoloic Reformation? Lawson has close ties to RC Sproul who may have change his eschatology views to post-mill.

Maybe you can elaborate more on your post as I am somewhat confuse on what is being said.

Last edited by John_C; Wed Nov 27, 2013 12:05 PM.

John Chaney

"having been firmly rooted and now being built up in Him and established in your faith . . ." Colossians 2:7
Peter #50224 Wed Nov 27, 2013 6:14 PM
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Peter Offline OP
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Here is what Wikipedia has on this:

The New Apostolic Reformation is a title originally used by C. Peter Wagner to describe a movement within Pentecostal and charismatic churches. The title New Apostolic Reformation is descriptive of a theological movement and is not an organization and therefore doesn't not have formal membership. Among those in the movement that inspired the title NAR, there is a wide range of variance on specific beliefs. Those within the movement hold to their denominational interpretations of the ongoing ministry of the Holy Spirit within each believer. Unlike some parts of Protestant Christianity, these include the direct revelation of Christ to each believer, prophecy, and the performance of miracles such as healing. This move has also been given the descriptive title, the Third Wave of the Holy Spirit.[2]

Although the movement regards the church as the true body of saved believers, as most Evangelical Protestants do, it differs from the broader Protestant tradition in its view on the nature of church leadership, specifically the doctrine of Five-Fold Ministry, which is based upon a non-traditional interpretation of Ephesians 4:11. C. Peter Wagner writes that most of the churches in this movement have active ministries of spiritual warfare.[3] As an example of this warfare he claims that God acted through him to end mad-cow disease in Germany. In an article responding to criticism of the NAR, Wagner notes that those who affiliate themselves with the movement believe the Apostles’ Creed and all the orthodoxyof Christian doctrine and therefore is not heretical. He goes on to list the differences between the NAR and traditional Protestantism.[1]

Apostolic governance – The Apostle Paul's assertion that Jesus appoints apostles within his church continues to this day.
The office of the prophet – There is within the church a role and function for present-day prophets.
Dominionism – "When Jesus came, He brought the kingdom of God and He expects His kingdom-minded people to take whatever action is needed to push back the long-standing kingdom of Satan and bring the peace and prosperity of His kingdom here on earth."[2]
Theocracy – Not to be confused with theocratic government but rather the goal to have "kingdom-minded people" in all areas of society. There are seven areas identified specifically: religion, family, education, government, media, arts & entertainment, and business.[1]
Extra-biblical revelation – There is available to all believers the ability to hear from God. "The one major rule governing any new revelation from God is that it cannot contradict what has already been written in the Bible. It may supplement it, however.
Supernatural signs and wonders – Signs and wonders such as healing, demonic deliverance and confirmed prophecies accompany the move of God.
Relational structures – church governance has no formal structure but rather relational and voluntary alignment to apostles.[4]

Wikipedia: New Apostolic Reformation

What I disagree with Lawson is lumping post-millenials in toto into this Dominionism espoused by these nut jobs. Loraine Boettner wouldn't have anything to do with that type of post-mill thought and frankly Lawson should have tempered his comments better.



Peter

If you believe what you like in the gospels, and reject what you don't like, it is not the gospel you believe, but yourself. Augustine of Hippo
Peter #50233 Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:50 AM
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Tom Offline
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What I disagree with Lawson is lumping post-millenials in toto into this Dominionism espoused by these nut jobs. Loraine Boettner wouldn't have anything to do with that type of post-mill thought and frankly Lawson should have tempered his comments better.

Good point Peter, although I am not a post-millennial, I know a lot of Reformed Baptists who are. They are definitely not into things like Dominionism etc.

Tom

Last edited by Tom; Sat Nov 30, 2013 1:50 AM.

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