The Highway Forums General Discussion Open Forum Predestination Question

Hi
My wife asked me a question related to God's predestination.
She asked me if I think God predestined that I would put on blue socks, rather than black socks this morning?
In other words, though God makes "all things work together for good..." as Romans 8:28 says. Does that "all things" include things like the colour of the socks we choose?
I want to take her question seriously and study the issue a little more before I say too much to her. But based on a few passages that come to mind such as Romans 8:28 "all things", would include the colour of the socks we choose a particular morning. Though I have to admit that I don't understand how a trivial thing like choosing the colour of our socks can work out to either good or bad.
Then again, I don't know the mind of God.
Would appreciate some feedback on this.
Thanks
Tom

That's an easy one to answer.

There is NOTHING..... absolutely NOTHING that God hasn't predestined and by His providence brings to pass. R.C. Sproul, Sr. makes a point of this in one of his lectures, which I think is from either "If There is a God, Why are there Atheists?", or in his 3-part series on Divine Sovereignty in "Divine Sovereignty and Human Freedom". And even if I'm incorrect in thinking it was one of those two lectures what he said was fabulous. He asked the group before whom he was speaking if they thought that God controlled EVERYTHING. Then he said that if you believe that is not true, then you are an Atheist. He then went on to explain in some detail that not even the smallest particle in an atom is outside of God's sovereignty and control. Because if there was even one minute thing that God didn't ordain providentially control, then the world would collapse into total chaos. He used an old proverb to illustrate his point that truth which goes like this (fyi, the word "want" is a synonym for "lack"):



Of course, the most succinct statement of this truth, I believe, is found in Scripture where Luke wrote:

God ordained the crucifixion of Christ in every single detail AND those who participated in that crucifixion did so most willingly and without any force contrary to their desire or will to do so.

NOTE: Notice that "determinate counsel" (decree, foreordination) precedes "foreknowledge", which depends and flows from God's eternal decree(s). Antagonists of biblical Calvinism invariably reverse the order and believe that God does what he foreknew, i.e., whatever God perceived as having already occurred. Which view, of course, logically denies the absolutely sovereignty of God and even more so, such a view denies deity itself.

Pilgrim
Thank you, that was quite helpful.
There are times when although I understand an issue enough to believe it. However, sometimes when I am asked to explain it, I can not come up with an explanation that makes logical sense to the person I am trying to explain it to.
In this case, my wife seems to believe and except the concept of predestination, but doesn't understand how that would include things like the colour of the socks we choose. She might not have a problem for a specific purpose in mind in order to bring a plan of God's to fruition. However, she does not see how those things are important to God all the time.
The way I see it however, is how do we know God doesn't have a purpose in mind in is choosing the colour of the socks we wear on a given day?
This of course might be argued against by saying something like: How in the world would sometime as trivial as us choosing the colour of our socks, alter God's plan?

You said my question is easy to answer and I think you gave a good answer, but I must admit I find it hard to wrap my mind around the whole thing.
By the way, I was also told Spurgeon spoke on this issue and it was somewhere along the same lines as RC Sproul's answer.
I think I am going to try to find it.
Tom

1. Predestination is typically understood as God's determination and election of a specific number of sinners to be saved in Christ. Perhaps she is confusing predestination with foreordination or decree(s) of God?

2. Foreordination or the decree(s) of God encompasses EVERYTHING which God determined to come to pass out of nothing. In short, whatever exists had a beginning which was created by God according to His will. Thus EVERYTHING has a purpose. There is no such word or concept as extraneous with God.

Remember, even EVERY single hair on a person's head has been numbered, (Matt 10:29,30) i.e., determined by God from all eternity.

Another way of putting all this is EVERYTHING that God has decreed/determined/foreordained from eternity is for the display of His own glory. Would it be proper to relegate ANYTHING to the "unimportant" bin?

Your saying the word "decree", made me realize that I may have added to her confusion, mainly because although I know the difference between "decree" and "predestination", somehow I did not pick up on that point.
Oh well, at least I can contribute more.

Thanks
Tom

I form light, and create darkness;
I make well-being, and create calamity;
I am the LORD, who does all these things.
Isaiah 45:7

The heart of man plans his way, but the LORD establishes his steps.
Proverbs 16:9

Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? And not one of them will fall to the ground apart from your Father. Matthew 10:29


I think these references is enough proof (and there is more) that everything was planned by God in eternity past