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Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #50626
Mon Apr 21, 2014 10:43 AM
Mon Apr 21, 2014 10:43 AM
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Since it has been awhile, perhaps someone new looking in who thinks that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week, and who thinks that Matthew 12:40 is using common Jewish idiomatic language so that 3 nights actually means 2 nights, will know of some writing.

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #50893
Thu Aug 21, 2014 4:34 PM
Thu Aug 21, 2014 4:34 PM
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Since it's been awhile, perhaps someone new looking in will know of some writing.

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #50964
Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:44 AM
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chestnutmare,

You have a question directed to you in post #50301.

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: Pilgrim] #50965
Wed Sep 17, 2014 7:54 AM
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Pilgrim,

re: " "Who else among confessional, conservative Christian churches holds to this view? I think there would be no list of groups in that case."

Not knowing your definition of "confessional, conservative Christian churches" makes it impossible for me to say. Are they those who say that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week?

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #50966
Wed Sep 17, 2014 8:34 AM
Wed Sep 17, 2014 8:34 AM
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Originally Posted By: rstrats
Pilgrim,

re: " "Who else among confessional, conservative Christian churches holds to this view? I think there would be no list of groups in that case."

Not knowing your definition of "confessional, conservative Christian churches" makes it impossible for me to say. Are they those who say that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week?

"confessional, conservatiave Christian churches" = All the historic Reformed confessions and catechisms which have been written, e.g., Helvetic Confessions, Thirty-Nine Articles, Belgic Confession, Westminster Confession, Westminster larger and Shorter Catechisms, London Baptist Confession, Savoy Declaration, Heidelberg Catechism, etc., all of which have been recognized in the true historic Protestant churches across denominational lines as being faithful summary statements of biblical teaching.


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Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: Pilgrim] #50968
Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:24 AM
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Pilgrim,

In answer to your question I have to say that I don't know. Are you saying that all those organizations believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week?



Last edited by rstrats; Wed Sep 17, 2014 9:24 AM.
Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #50969
Wed Sep 17, 2014 10:44 AM
Wed Sep 17, 2014 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted By: rstrats
Pilgrim,

In answer to your question I have to say that I don't know. Are you saying that all those organizations believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week?

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying... i.e., what Dr. William Hendriksen wrote and which I quoted for you HERE and explained further in my subsequent replies is representative of historic Protestantism and held by all the framers of all the confessions and catechisms of the various denominations and churches which are part of the true Church. Jesus was buried on Friday and rose on Sunday. If that is what you are referring to as the "6th Day" view, then that is what is held to be true by them.

The disciples certainly held that view and that's one of the major reasons why they began meeting on Sunday, the first day of the week vs. Saturday which was the Jewish sabbath. THIS is what I believe is where you want to go with this, correct? You are trying to lay a foundation to justify Saturday as the 'true' Sabbath rather than Sunday, correct?


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Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #50970
Wed Sep 17, 2014 11:04 AM
Wed Sep 17, 2014 11:04 AM
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Let me add a little more of Hendriksen's exegesis of Matthew 12:40 and specifically on this matter of when was Jesus buried and how long he was in the tomb before His resurrection:

Quote:
Nevertheless, again and again-sometimes in small pamphlets-the opinion will be advocated that according to Matt. 12:40 Jesus must have died and been buried on Thursday. This, however, is definitely wrong, for the inspired records tell us that these events took place on Friday, that is, on Paraskeue, this very word being used even in modern Greek to indicate Friday (Mark 15:42, 43; Luke 23:46, 54; John 19:14, 30, 42). Also, if the proponents of this "Jesus was buried on Thursday afternoon" theory demand that "three days" means three entire days, their theory will still fall short; and, on the other hand, if, as they see it, a part of a day must be figured as a day, the result is: too many days!

Neither is it entirely satisfactory to say that, while Jesus died indeed on Friday and rose again on Sunday morning, the solution is to be found in the fact that, as already proved, the Jews counted a part of the day as equal to a day, and a part of the night as amounting to a night. As far as the "days" are concerned, this would be a satisfactory explanation, but it would still leave us with only two nights, not three.

What then? Some, despairing of a solution, declare that the saying, though having been a part of the Gospel from the beginning, is spurious, never having been uttered by Jesus himself. There is, however, no good reason thus to cut the Gordian knot. The true solution probably lies in a different direction. When we say "the universe," the ancients would say "heaven and earth." So also, should not their expression "one day and one night" be taken to mean one time unit, one diurnal period, a part of one such period being taken as a whole? He was indeed in the heart of the earth three "days-and-three-nights," that is during three of these time units.


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Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #50974
Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:09 AM
Fri Sep 26, 2014 8:09 AM
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Pilgrim,

re: "The disciples certainly held that view and that's one of the major reasons why they began meeting on Sunday, the first day of the week vs. Saturday which was the Jewish sabbath."

I'm not aware of any scripture that says that the disciples began meeting on the first day of the week in recognition of the resurrection. What do you have in mind?


re: "THIS is what I believe is where you want to go with this, correct? You are trying to lay a foundation to justify Saturday as the 'true' Sabbath rather than Sunday, correct?"

Not for the purpose of this topic. I simply am interested in what is requested in the OP.

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #51062
Fri Nov 21, 2014 2:47 PM
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Since it's been awhile, someone new looking in may know of some writing.

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #52827
Sun Jan 01, 2017 8:01 AM
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A further rewording of the OP may make it a bit more clear. The Messiah said that 3 night times would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth". However, there are those who believe that the Messiah died on the 6th day of the week and who think that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb or at the earliest to the time between the leaving of His spirit from His body and His resurrection on the 1st day of the week. But this belief allows for only 2 night times to be involved. To reconcile this discrepancy some say that the Messiah was using common Jewish idiomatic language. I am simply asking for examples to support that assertion; i.e., instances where a daytime or a night time was forecast to be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred. But in order to say that it was common, one would have to know of other instances where the same pattern had to have been used. I am simply looking for some of those instances, scriptural or otherwise. So far no one has come forth with any.

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #52830
Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:59 PM
Sun Jan 01, 2017 2:59 PM
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Hi rstrats,

I see that you have had suitable responses and it appears that you simply are rejecting them for some reason. Why is that? Is there something that you wish to put forward? Something that the church has throughout history not discovered before you? Why are you rejecting Hendricksen's explanation?


The Chestnut Mare
All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by frost.
- - - -JRR Tolkien "Lord of the Rings"
Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: chestnutmare] #52831
Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:31 PM
Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:31 PM
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chestnutmare,
re: "Why are you rejecting Hendricksen's explanation?

I'm afraid I still don't see where Hendricksen - or anyone else for that matter - has provided examples which show that it was common to forecast that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred.

Last edited by rstrats; Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:32 PM.
Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: rstrats] #52837
Tue Jan 03, 2017 2:22 AM
Tue Jan 03, 2017 2:22 AM
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Read the quotes Pilgrim posted on Hendricksen again, I believe I read what you are looking for there.
Unfortunately, I am heading to bed right now or I would quote where.

Tom

Re: Matthew 12:40 [Re: Tom] #52838
Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:53 AM
Tue Jan 03, 2017 9:53 AM
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Tom,
re: "Read the quotes Pilgrim posted on Hendricksen again,"


I still don't find where he has provided examples which show that it was common to forecast that a daytime or a night time would be involved with an event when no part of the daytime or no part of the night time could have occurred.

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