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#10114 Sun Jan 18, 2004 4:18 PM
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I struggled even trying to figure out where to post this: in the Prayer or Open Forum. Since, sound advice will probably be given I figured the Open Forum may be the best, though most definitely prayer should not be neglected.

Under the posts of each of us here lies a person. I would say that the majority of us struggle with something or at least has a friend that is. Yes struggling with sin, but a specific sin that really gets to us—you know the one, or two. All Christians have these type of struggles (and if you do not then judge yourself if you be in the faith) and yet very little is ever discussed about them. Most are afraid of them even being exposed, much less discussing them with a friend or a stranger (which sometimes is easier).

While each here hopefully has a strong relationship with the Lord have you ever wondered why you are still struggling? Have you sought out proper counsel? Have you received proper counsel? Do you know what the Scripture says concerning your situation? I am not sure anything will be accomplished by this series of posts, which I hope will be forthcoming, but I believe we may each (1) understand each other more fully (2) pray for each other more effectively, and (3) build each other up in the faith.

MY Struggle:

As most of you know back in the 70s I was a homicide detective. This type of work makes you very hardened in several ways. I had arrived to the point that I could walk into a murder scene and eat lunch while working the scene (they no longer do this as it contaminates the scene, but this was then). Blood, gore, brains on the ceiling, etc., no longer phased me in the least bit. I had been shot at and stabbed a couple of times and was quickly climbing the ladder of success. Yes, this is considered success by some standards. Along with this comes an attitude of control. A police officer must be in control, or else he is dead—all understand this, but it transfers over into every area of your life. I became saved and then a ministry developed and now I am here….

Ok, so far, right? Not really. When I became a Christian I saw great victory in a allot of areas instantly. I no longer cussed, nor desired to. I prayed to receive the ability to cry and weep and yes, I now can. I received this amazing urge to read and learn. There were several others, but this is not the point of the post.

One issue seemed to stay behind. The control issue always seems to pop up. The ability to express myself wisely while being in control, without being overbearing. The police teach a very rigid standard here. One wrong slip with a “weak” tone, a word, or a phrase may be your life—literally.

I learned their methodology very well, but it was applied to every part of my life. Though a commanding voice is good to have at times the attitude that can accompany it is not, or at least can be non-Christian. I struggle to get myself from under its control. I am familiar enough with the Scriptures regarding this. I have sought out the proper counsel, but it is still a daily battle. For the most part I have seen victory in my verbal skills, but not in my written ones. Every time I post I must modify something as I think I am being too harsh or should have phrased something differently—attempting to express the truth fully, and not to be mis-understood, et. al. My writing must under go tremendous re-wording at times. Thus, I ask for your understanding and prayers.

P.S. These posts are not meant to be a form of "professional" counseling or a replacement for pastoral counseling you may desire...IMHO it is both Scriptural and comforting to seek out such from a qualified individuals (NANC) that may assist us. Of course, sitting under the Word of God and living out one's Christian life is of utmost importance, as well.


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Hey Joe,

You have my understanding.. and my ear a lot of the times. I have never read anything of yours that offended me, and I do say, that it took a lot of courage to be honest like you have.

I struggle with the same sort of thing that you do among many other things. I will write just a small snippet of my own story to explain. I grew up in an extremely abusive situation. Physical abuse was not constant, but mental, emotional abuse/neglect and an awful lot of sexual abuse were constant. All of which, the baptist church that my second mother took me too knew, but did nothing about. I'm sure the people here have seen the messes that have come out of those situations.

As a result, in my life, I wound up searching religion, found the Charismatics.. or rather they found me LOL. Of course, I fell away from all that, only to have a son, raise him for four years and place him for adoption. That was so painful. I never had any relationships with men, I just slept with them. After my son was gone, and the few Christian men I knew wanted to "help me along in my grief" in the same manner as any red blooded heathen would.. I decided to go for women. Which i did for a little while. I had my nose peirced twice, and several tattooes etc etc.

Then I met my husband. You can imagine, I was very harsh, and very hard hearted. Swore like a trucker.. the whole shebang. I think the bible calls that a "clamorous woman."

Then, four years ago.... the Lord drew me to repentance. I did a full 180. My husband was pretty suprised! LOL. He doesn't like it very much either.

My point is that I still have a real problem with the area of being too strong in my communication. That was usuallyl to cover up extreme sensitivity. That seems to be balancing out now.. but I want nothing more than for God to culitivate in me a gentle and quiet spirit.. yet it alludes me! Another one is one that I wrote in the other thread. I smoke, but God knows I have tried. I finally stopped trying to quit because it was driving me into the ground! I think God has shown me that my reason for smoking has more to do with other things rather than addiction necessarily. But I would rather smoke and not be angry, or so "fist on the table to make a point" kind of person. I am not so much like that now, it is definately getting better.. but I still hate it.

This is probably not what you (Joe) are talking about, but it still comes out the same way eh? LOL.

Anyway.. I feel like it's a big risk to write this, but it's not like I'm telling my neighbor lol. No one in my life knows this stuff for the most part. I think it's a shame that it's not easier to talk about these things in real life. After starting to learn about calvinism/reformed theology, I felt that God directed me to the right thing, and now I am totally interested in how it relates to real life day to day situations.. but it's hard to get there when you can't share. So I guess I am saying I appreciate that you started this thread.

Thanks,
Michele

P.S. I forgot to answer the questions you asked LOL. I have not really sought out proper counsel on these matters since being born again. Whenever anyone hears even just a small part of what has gone on in my life, they are usually too shocked and too overwhelmed to even know where to start. There is SO much more to it than I have revealed here. So I deal with it on my own, and I guess I am failing. But I don't know where to go with it. And I most certainly, and definately absolutely never never ever want to tell anyone that I know that i used to date women! That would get me nice and shunned from any "respectable" social circle! LOL I am deathly afraid of being ignored. That's what would happen.. or I would be patronized. Not goin' there!

Last edited by MHeath; Sun Jan 18, 2004 6:37 PM.
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Joe,
I am sure we all have Romans 7 issues that we are dealing with. One of mine is having a mother who was a school administrator. She is a very controlling woman. My mother talks all the time. She has very strong opinions and knows absolutely everything. Before I was a Christian, I didn't have strong opinions about anything. Then when I found something that I knew was true, I had solid ground to stand on and started having strong convictions about things, like why abortion is wrong. Later, I realized that I had became much more like my Mom than I ever wanted to be! <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> It drives my husband crazy at times. His mother is the sweetest, most gracious and mild mannered lady there is. So, I have to hold myself back a lot.

I, like you have to re-read my posts to see if there is anything that may be unkind or preachy or arrogant. Sometimes I have a very bad temper.
I think it takes a kind of hardness to fight in the Lord's battles. Being treated unfairly and being falsely accused is part of the territory. My ungodly attitudes are part of the battle too. There is a danger that our hearts can become calloused and that we start to see those with whom we disagree as our enemies instead of someone the Lord would have us love and instruct. I haven't "gotten there" either. We all need more grace to speak the truth in love. We all have strengths and weaknesses and are growing in sanctification. The Lord is very patient with us. One of the signs of spiritual growth is that we see our sins more keenly and we grieve over them more and more, even if we are having victory over certain other areas where we had been defeated before.

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You indeed have had it much harder than I. There is no way I could even began to tell you that I understand what you have suffered. The Lord is marvelous in the way He can deliver us from the deepest depths of our depravity to the essence of His glory through His Son. You indeed have a marvelous deliverance story to tell. Anyone who has had to deal with some of the issues you have had to experience indeed could benefit from good counsel. The Lord has indeed strengthened you so far, but you may benefit from NANC (it is about as good as it gets). They will keep your confidence, normally work with you even financially (if needed), and use only Biblical steps in their process. Something else I also keep is a network of a few friends that I fully trust and may confide in. They are allowed to question me about any issue. It takes time to develop such relationships, but they are so valuable in the area of accountability.

The Lord is doing a marvelous work in you Michele. May He continue to bless your life.


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#10118 Sun Jan 18, 2004 8:13 PM
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IMHO in some ways it is good to be like your mom—strong opinions. I realize the negative part (I am allot like my dad was), but I think there is a rich side in that you are willing to stand up for what you believe and not wimp out, like so many. You strive for the truth in matters and then set your feet firm. Sometimes God has to till the ground under us to get “us” to move even a little <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/rofl.gif" alt="" /> Also, you do no come across as always thinking you are right—at least not here. You, IMHO try to play a pretty even field in proper discernment—though it may be a struggle for you, I do not see it in your posts, so God is well at work.


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Joe,
Quote
When I became a Christian I saw great victory in a allot of areas instantly. I no longer cussed, nor desired to. I prayed to receive the ability to cry and weep and yes, I now can. I received this amazing urge to read and learn
Wow, I had almost the same experiences.
As an unmarried single man, my biggest struggle is lust. I've been really praying hard for purity and for a wife. What has been helping most in this area is Owen's writings and prayer. Although sometimes I get lazy in my spiritual battles. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/ugh.gif" alt="" />

in Christ,
Carlos


"Let all that mind...the peace and comfort of their own souls, wholly apply themselves to the study of Jesus Christ, and him crucified"(Flavel)
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Dear Michele,
What a sad story you have shared, but how great the love and mercy of God that He has made you a new creature in Christ and clothed in His righteousness! You have been washed and sanctified and you are His holy child. I am so grieved and angry that your mother would not protect you and the church did nothing to deal with the sin but ignored it! It would break my heart to give up a child too. Such hard things you have dealt with, but God is greater than all these things. He is a tender and loving Father. He binds up broken hearts.
I wish you could have heard our sermon today! We had a guest preacher and he chose Matthew 1: 1-17 as his text. Usually the genealogy lists are not very interesting to me and I sort of plow through them to get on to better things. He brought out so many wonderful things in that genealogy.
Below is from the brief notes I took. His sermon was much more detailed and better than this.
One of his points he brought out was that the line of Christ shows a list of people who were notpeople of great status, but this list includes people who were gentiles, who were unknown, and even outcasts. Among the women were Rahab the prostitute, Bathsheba who isn't named but called the wife of Uriah, and Ruth the Moabite. Women had no status and their testimony was not even admissable in court. It even includes King Manassah who was a very wicked king. This is a demonstration of God's grace. The gospel comes not by power or by might, but by His gracious Spirit. We are included not because we deserve it or have earned it. We are not included among God's people because of our efforts, but are only included because of the blood of the Lamb. He has saved us, redeemed us, built us up for His glory. Revel in the grace of God! Jesus is the fulfillment of all the OT promises. In Christ there is life where there was death, righteousness, peace, rest, hope that is never diminished, that never disappoints, glory, purity, beauty, wisdom-- resources never to be exhausted.

#10121 Sun Jan 18, 2004 9:29 PM
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Hi <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Thanks Susan <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> I hope it's okay to go ahead and say this, I don't want to keep going on and on.. but you mentioned my mother. I didn't know her growing up. My dad was married three more times. Every one of them was abusive as well. And since my dad was such a sick person, he would marry sick women.. of course. So they all blamed me for being 'the other woman.' <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/uptosomething.gif" alt="" /> how ridiculous. Anyway, I did meet my biological mother, and we do not have a relationship. Shes crazy. Such is life. BUT.. there is a psalm in which David says, "when my father and my mother forsake me, then the Lord will take care of me." I have always felt sort of special in that sense. Not to sound immodest.. but when God is your only father AND mother.. I suppose one better not MESS with me! LOL I guess I see it in the same way as how I feel about my daughters.. heaven help the foo who messes wit 'em! Am I RIGHT?? lolol..

Anyway.. yes.. thank you for the very encouraging post. I suppose that is yet another struggle though.. I have a hard time teaching my daughters how to be feminine. Oh I guess I could go on! But I won't. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/moron.gif" alt="" />

Michele

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Hint in finding a wife. Stop looking and then she will show up <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/drop.gif" alt="" />...at least that is what happened to me.--of course not all experiences are the same.

Lust is a subject that many males (and fewer females) are being entrapped by. Internet pornography has lead the way in much of it in today's world, along just with common T.V. sitcoms. Brother I know you know the truth about this issue, so please know we will continue to be in prayer for you. May God bless.


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I know lust has been mentioned, and I do struggle with that a whole lot. There is something else though. I have a hard time letting people see my weakness and letting people see my brokenness. When things start going downhill, and I get to a place where all I want and can think of to do is cry, I don't want people to see that. And that is hard on me and a struggle because of the possibility of the relationship with this girl I mentioned about in the thread on emotions and such and verses about that, I need to be as open and honest as possible, and it is really hard because of me not wanting to let those emotions show.

Not sure if this in itself is a sin, but I think deeper down it is a pride struggle. And that is a bad thing.

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I struggle with many sins-as some can see here. What I believe to be my biggest "struggle" is set out in Matthew 5:28.."But I say unto you,that whosoever looketh on a women to lust after her hath commited adultery with her already in his heart"

Of all the many changes God has wrought to my life , this one thing seems to have plauged me all my adult life. I simply cannot avert my eyes from beautiful women and control my thoughts thereafter.I really have no wish to pluck my eyes out.

#10125 Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:21 AM
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Well crying can be a good thing. Sometimes though it is a sign of one feeling sorry for themselves or depression. You would have to ask yourself why (the real reasons) you react the way you do. Sometimes it is good to get away to reflect and pray, but if you have just having a pity party it shows a lack of (1) faith in God in a particular area (2) respect for God's sovereignty in the situation. We all have different emotional make-ups as well and thus you may be more prone to this type of reaction without it being a sin. Pride as you stated is a serious matter.

You will be in our prayers.


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#10126 Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:41 AM
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Mark,

You have a struggle that many a man faces. What things have you done to avert such sin? Most use what I call a "white knuckle approach." They get before God pray, "repent," and then hope they make it through. They make it for a while but sooner or later their knuckles tire and they give in.

In dealing with any sin the first thing I do (1) get before God and throughly discuss the situation with every passage of Scripture that can be found on the subject (2) ask God to bring me to His repentance in the area and faith towards Him (items 1 & 2 may take weeks and not just a day or two) (3) I continue to renew my mind with the truth (the original Scriptures I went to God with) ...

When I do not see results (normally I do) I know that I have missed something in the repentance area. That is I am still hanging on to something in the flesh that is over riding my obedience to God. Thus, it is time for re-examination. What I find most of the time is my pride and selfishnesses pitied against God's sovereignty and glory. I find that I do not love God to the fullness I should. I find I do not trust Him as much as I think I do. Repentance then brings me to a newer and deeper relationship....this is an ongoing process. In many ways I believe God allows this (no I am not saying this to justify ANY sin) so we will see the depths of our depravity and so we will see the glory of His grace and the victory and deliverance of His Word in time. In other words that we will know beyond any doubt that it was He and not us that delivered...


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I too struggle with the same sin that Mark, Carlos and others mentioned. One thing that has helped me a great deal in this area is confessing this sin to an accountability partner, and mine just happens to be my wife, who has authority over my body (the passage is in 1 Corinthians somewhere), to whom I must go with sins of a sexual nature. My wife is wonderfully forgiving, and dealing with this issue in particular over the last year or so (where it was never dealt with previously) has brought us to a new place of intimacy. If you're not married, I would recommend getting with another male in whom you can confide. For me, making the committment that I was going to be accountable to my wife about this immediately gave me a HUGE disincentive to be disobedient, or positively, a HUGE incentive to be obedient, as I didn't want to have to go to her with the sin again, because I realized how much it impaired our relationship for one (but more importantly, my relationship with Christ).

#10128 Mon Jan 19, 2004 11:10 AM
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My wife is only too aware of this particular sin of mine.
She is of course my wife,and therefore incredibly understanding and prayerful.

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