Posts: 1,865
Joined: September 2001
|
|
|
Forums30
Topics7,781
Posts54,881
Members974
|
Most Online732 Jan 15th, 2023
|
|
|
#29802
Fri Dec 09, 2005 3:31 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428
Addict
|
OP
Addict
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428 |
<font face="Impact">Shame on you, Benedict!</font>
Nonbelievers Too Can Be Saved, Says Pope
VATICAN CITY, NOV. 30, 2005 (Zenit.org).- Whoever seeks peace and the good of the community with a pure conscience, and keeps alive the desire for the transcendent, will be saved even if he lacks biblical faith, says Benedict XVI.
On a rainy morning in Rome, the Holy Father ...addressed ...more than 23,000 people gathered in St. Peter's Square, (saying):
(A)mong the inhabitants of Babylon there are people who are committed to peace and the good of the community, despite the fact that they do not share the biblical faith, that they do not know the hope of the Eternal City to which we aspire.... They have a spark of desire for the unknown, for the greatest, for the transcendent, for a genuine redemption.... (A)mong the nonbelievers, there are people with this spark, with a kind of faith, of hope, in the measure that is possible for them in the circumstances in which they live.... With this faith in an unknown reality, they are really on the way to the authentic Jerusalem, to Christ.... God will not allow them to perish with Babylon, having predestined them to be citizens of Jerusalem, on the condition, however, that, living in Babylon, they do not seek pride, outdated pomp and arrogance.
Grace is not common.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,450 Likes: 57
Head Honcho
|
Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,450 Likes: 57 |
Let's not forget, however, that unless the Pope spoke "ex cathedra", his words are not binding upon anyone. So despite the incredibly unbiblical statement, it doesn't hold any sway and it gives the RCC a way out. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
simul iustus et peccator
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428
Addict
|
OP
Addict
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428 |
Pilgrim, I know I know I know! Ah the loopholes of the Roman Catholic Church. So, even though this is in contradiction not only to the Scriptures but to writings of previous RCC theologians, Popes, and Church Fathers, there really "is no contradiction" since this was not spoken ex cathedra - just like the previous Pope and his caving on evolution.
Grace is not common.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,450 Likes: 57
Head Honcho
|
Head Honcho
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 14,450 Likes: 57 |
You have to realize that the RCC is "becoming" more evan-jelly-cal, i.e., "becoming all things to all men", by interpretation which means, assimilating the church to the world. There's no prohibition against the RCC from jumping on the "Emerging Church" bandwagon, ya know. Remember that we can all learn from each other regardless of our personal beliefs. <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />
simul iustus et peccator
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428
Addict
|
OP
Addict
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428 |
You are right. But wait - who are we to judge? Their views are as good as yours and mine. Maybe they have a point. I need to stop being so intolerant.... <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/puke.gif" alt="" />
Grace is not common.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,516 Likes: 13
Needs to get a Life
|
Needs to get a Life
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 4,516 Likes: 13 |
What I find ironic, is the fact that both this pope and the last are/were considered conservatives.
Tom
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428
Addict
|
OP
Addict
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428 |
But they ARE conservative - remember, to most conservative and liberal are political monikers. Both Popes are against abortion, thus both popes are conservative (politically).
Grace is not common.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 251
Enthusiast
|
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 251 |
Well at least he mentions predestination!!!!!!
Are you sure this was not taken out of context? HAs he received any flack about this statement? I mean protties went from no salvation possible, to seperated brethren. Now he espouses universalism based on works of peace and charity?
There never was a sinner half as big as Christ is as a Savior.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428
Addict
|
OP
Addict
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428 |
Actually Pope John Paul II said exactly the same thing. It is not unique to Benedict.
/scc/
Grace is not common.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 251
Enthusiast
|
Enthusiast
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 251 |
I just read the whole article. It appears to be speakign of the Jews. He says he is quoting augustine. Poor gus gets abused by both the rcc and protties at times.
He also mentions the "spark" of faith attempting to pervert Paul speaking on Mars Hill about the "unknown God"
There never was a sinner half as big as Christ is as a Savior.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428
Addict
|
OP
Addict
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 428 |
Lest we think this is isolated to simply Benedict:
From the Catchism of the Catholic Church
CCC#841: 841 The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."
Notice what this says: 1) People can be saved outside of faith in Christ 2) People can worship God without worshipping the triune God
Seems to me there are numerous heresies in the above!
Steve
Grace is not common.
|
|
|
|
1 members (John_C),
48
guests, and
16
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
|
|
|
|
|
1
|
2
|
3
|
4
|
5
|
6
|
7
|
8
|
9
|
10
|
11
|
12
|
13
|
14
|
15
|
16
|
17
|
18
|
19
|
20
|
21
|
22
|
23
|
24
|
25
|
26
|
27
|
28
|
29
|
30
|
31
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
There are no members with birthdays on this day. |
|
|
|
|