Whoa! Talk about a ghost from the past! I thought you had taken off never to return. <br><br><blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>[color:"blue"]He does give them the power to remain by the Holy Ghost, but He does not force them to remain. I am opposed to eternal security on Biblical grounds.</font><hr></blockquote><p><br><br>The problem, though Josh, is that you have not provided any meaningful exegesis as to why eternal security is not biblical. Instead, you have flooded our posting group with verses taken out of context and a tortured exegesis of the Bible that conforms the Bible to the presuppositions of your particular conditional security beliefs. Furthermore, you have not answered my original question that I posed months ago when I first posted on the Highway list. That being, do men maintain their freewill in heaven after they are in the eternal state? Will men have the ability to leave heaven if they so choose by the exercise of their freewill? Why or Why not? If they can choose salvation, and even return to their original lostness by the mere expression of their free choice now in this world, why would it be any different in the eternal state?<br><br><blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>[color:"blue"]Ephesians says that it is God's will that the elect be saved, but many times the Bible makes it clear that God's will is not always done by men (see Luke 13:34). The Bible also speaks of us still striving towards the goal of salvation in Christ Jesus…..<br><br>So there is no contradiction in having the righteousness of Christ, and still striving to enter the narrow gate.</font><hr></blockquote><p><br><br>But how does this demonstrate a loss of salvation? This is where your argument falls apart. We would agree with you that believers are to strive toward the goal as Paul writes, but there is a stark difference between striving to pursue a sanctified life and growth in holiness, and striving for fear of loosing salvation. Do you actually think that the only reason we are to pursue righteousness is because of fear of being cut off from the Lord? What sort of salvation is that? Moreover, I believe Pilgrim raised a good point in one of his posts to you from last week or so. Those of your ilk, like Dan Corner who madly advocate conditional security, tend to externalize righteousness and sinfulness, rather than recognize a changed heart that conforms a person to godliness. Christ was concerned with heart change, not just external works. Where we part company is that you would believe that the person changes his heart by the act of his freewill, and we Calvinists confirm what the Bible teaches, that God is the one that changes the heart, thus freeing the will to love and pursue godliness. <br><br>Fred

"Ah, sitting - the great leveler of men. From the mightest of pharaohs to the lowest of peasants, who doesn't enjoy a good sit?" M. Burns