The Highway Forums General Discussion Theology Discussion Forum "Love your enemies" and "Does God love all"

hisalone,

1) Where did you get this distinction between "a subjective and an objective love"? I agree that God is love as I also would affirm that God is holy, jealous, righteous, etc., as to His attributes. But I would also affirm that the attribute of love is NOT supreme. All His attributes are equal. However, if there was one attribute which overshadowed all others it would have to be "holiness". God's love is holy but it cannot be said that God's holiness is love.

2) Re: "God's love is available to all mankind". Contrariwise, God's love is not "available" but rather "displayed in Christ as the one and only Saviour. The Scripture nowhere teaches that God's love is up for grabs according to some decision of a sinner's choice. Even if not one single individual believed on Christ, God's love in sending Christ would not be diminished one iota. However, God's purpose in sending Christ was to "save His people from their sins", i.e., there is a particular and specific number of sinners for whom Christ came and for whom He died in order to secure their salvation through His atoning sacrifice. God's love is not sentimentalism but rather it is a determined action which accomplishes that which was purposed. Thus, if God loved ALL (indiscriminately) and without distinction, then de facto, ALL would be saved.

3) Re: Jacob and Esau. The text in Romans is taken from Malachi 1:3. If one consults the original text, it is clearly noted that God's hatred of Esau was not just one of holding back covenant promises but rather a concerted animosity toward him and his descendants whereby all their efforts to advance in life would be thwarted by God.

4) The fact that I have provided not just one but several passages which express God's divine hatred against certain individuals and/or groups disproves any notion that God loves all, without distinction and that there is a difference in how God deals with sinners. Eph 1:4 shows that God loved the elect in Christ and no other way. For indeed, God's holiness prohibits Him from loving any UNLESS they are "in Christ" Who is the reconciliation and propitiation for sinners. Outside of Christ, God simply CANNOT and WILL NOT love anyone. (cf. Hab 1:13)

Let's consider a few passages and see how your view holds up, shall we?

Psalms 1:6 (ASV) "For Jehovah knoweth the way of the righteous; But the way of the wicked shall perish." - The word "know" here cannot refer to God's "factual knowledge" for He is Omniscient. He knows ALL about the righteous and the wicked for He created them and providentially directs even their very thoughts. The reference to "know" here is actually a synonym for "love". The Bible often uses this phraseology in this manner, e.g., Genesis 4:1 where "Adam knew his wife . . ." It isn't that Adam knew some facts about Eve that resulted in her getting pregnant.

Matthew 7:22-23 (ASV) "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy by thy name, and by thy name cast out demons, and by thy name do many mighty works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Again, Jesus Christ, being God incarnate was intimately familiar with those who professed to do His works. Yet, He says He never knew them. The word know, once again, isn't referring to "knowledge about" but rather "love for". His love is only for the elect, i.e., His love is akin to salvation.

Romans 8:29-30 (ASV) "For whom he foreknew, he also foreordained [to be] conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren: and whom he foreordained, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified." In this passage the word "foreknew" is a synonym for "foreloved" (cf. Eph 1:4). What is important to notice here is that God's "forelove" RESULTS in salvation to all who were predestinated. Love = election --> predestination = salvation. In short, the love of God in Scripture most always refers to God saving the object of His love.

Thus, to assert that God loves ALL men indiscriminately and in the same way is indefensible. If you think it is, then please supply a biblical defense. I too am not trying to be difficult but rather to set forth biblical teaching concerning God's infinite love, aka: grace. From a personal point of view, I cannot fathom that God loved all those in Hell in the same way, in the exact proportion as those who are elected by grace to be reconciled to Him in Christ. It denigrates the entire concept of sovereign love/grace. The hymn "Amazing Grace" would be inappropriate and senseless. One of the most loved hymns of those who have been saved by the power and grace of God is "And Can it be that I Should Gain?". Do pay particular attention to the lyrics for they express the biblical truth that God's incomprehensible love is particular and efficacious, not objective nor subjective.

And can it be that I should gain
An interest in the Savior’s blood?
Died He for me, who caused His pain—
For me, who Him to death pursued?
Amazing love! How can it be,
That Thou, my God, shouldst die for me?
Amazing love! How can it be,
That Thou, my God, shouldst die for me?

’Tis mystery all: th’Immortal dies:
Who can explore His strange design?
In vain the firstborn seraph tries
To sound the depths of love divine.
’Tis mercy all! Let earth adore,
Let angel minds inquire no more.
’Tis mercy all! Let earth adore;
Let angel minds inquire no more.

He left His Father’s throne above
So free, so infinite His grace—
Emptied Himself of all but love,
And bled for Adam’s helpless race:
’Tis mercy all, immense and free,
For O my God, it found out me!
’Tis mercy all, immense and free,
For O my God, it found out me!

Long my imprisoned spirit lay,
Fast bound in sin and nature’s night;
Thine eye diffused a quickening ray—
I woke, the dungeon flamed with light;
My chains fell off, my heart was free,
I rose, went forth, and followed Thee.
My chains fell off, my heart was free,
I rose, went forth, and followed Thee.

Still the small inward voice I hear,
That whispers all my sins forgiven;
Still the atoning blood is near,
That quenched the wrath of hostile Heaven.
I feel the life His wounds impart;
I feel the Savior in my heart.
I feel the life His wounds impart;
I feel the Savior in my heart.

No condemnation now I dread;
Jesus, and all in Him, is mine;
Alive in Him, my living Head,
And clothed in righteousness divine,
Bold I approach th’eternal throne,
And claim the crown, through Christ my own.
Bold I approach th’eternal throne,
And claim the crown, through Christ my own.

In His grace,