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Wes said: Why would any Christian parent who is in a right relationship with the Lord and His Church want to exclude their child from this external mark of inclusion in the covenant community of believers? Wes
According to Dr. Lee, Calvin would not have dying children baptized. For Calvin, emergency baptism is based on a incorrect understanding of purpose of baptism. Children already have the spark of faith under the covenant so baptism is unnecessary. In any case, baptism must be done lawfully (i.e., by an ordained minister) and especially not by women.
The Second Helvetic Confession appears to echo this.
The Minister of Baptism. We teach that baptism should not be administered in the Church by women or midwives. For Paul deprived women of ecclesiastical duties, and baptism has to do with these. Anabaptists. We condemn the Anabaptists, who deny that newborn infants of the faithful are to be baptized. For according to evangelical teaching, of such is the Kingdom of God, and they are in the covenant of God. Why, then, should the sign of God's covenant not be given to them? Why should those who belong to God and are in his Church not be initiated by holy baptism? We condemn also the Anabaptists in the rest of their peculiar doctrines which they hold contrary to the Word of God. We therefore are not Anabaptists and have nothing in common with them.
Although appearing to favor infant baptism, the SHC could also be interpreted as saying emergency baptism is unnecessary since newborn infants are already under the covenant and their baptism is merely a sign of what has already occurred. So infant baptism can be safely be neglected on legalistic grounds.
The Westminister Confession seems to be out of sync with the SHC, ". . .it is a great sin to contemn or neglect this ordinance. . ." So, emergency baptism is defended by the WCF as a means of obeying God's command to baptize covenant infants.
Whereas, WCF presents emergency infant baptism as a matter of obeying God's law; the SHC appears to imply that, under certain circumstances, emergency infant baptism is actually disobeying God's law (e.g., a midwife baptizing a dying infant).
Am I correct or am I misunderstanding Calvin and misreading these Reform confessions?
Entire Thread
"We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Sat Jul 02, 2005 11:25 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Wes
Sat Jul 02, 2005 1:43 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
MarieP
Sun Jul 03, 2005 3:05 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Wes
Sun Jul 03, 2005 3:38 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Sun Jul 03, 2005 5:01 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:44 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Sun Jul 03, 2005 1:51 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sun Jul 03, 2005 6:29 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Sun Jul 03, 2005 1:40 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:03 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Tue Jul 05, 2005 1:17 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:34 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:46 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:23 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Sun Jul 03, 2005 2:40 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Tue Jul 05, 2005 11:12 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Tue Jul 05, 2005 11:56 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Wed Jul 06, 2005 6:39 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Mon Jul 11, 2005 2:48 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:43 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
MarieP
Tue Jul 12, 2005 12:42 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Tue Jul 12, 2005 1:21 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Tue Jul 12, 2005 4:44 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Thu Jul 14, 2005 2:49 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Pilgrim
Thu Jul 14, 2005 3:47 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Fri Jul 15, 2005 2:17 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Pilgrim
Fri Jul 15, 2005 3:18 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Fri Jul 15, 2005 1:08 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Sat Jul 16, 2005 7:52 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:01 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:47 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:02 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Sun Jul 17, 2005 4:46 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Mon Jul 18, 2005 4:58 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Mon Jul 18, 2005 1:45 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Tue Jul 19, 2005 3:56 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:20 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Wed Jul 20, 2005 10:58 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Wed Jul 20, 2005 12:15 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Wed Jul 20, 2005 3:20 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Wed Jul 20, 2005 5:01 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Thu Jul 21, 2005 3:38 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Thu Jul 21, 2005 11:50 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Fri Jul 22, 2005 10:11 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Fri Jul 22, 2005 11:21 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Sun Jul 24, 2005 11:11 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Sun Jul 24, 2005 11:45 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Mon Jul 25, 2005 11:04 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Tue Jul 26, 2005 10:47 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Pilgrim
Sun Jul 03, 2005 4:17 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Anonymous
Sun Jul 03, 2005 10:19 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
Pilgrim
Sun Jul 03, 2005 11:17 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
guidedbygrace
Fri Jul 29, 2005 6:35 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Sat Jul 30, 2005 5:40 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
MarieP
Sat Jul 30, 2005 2:03 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Sat Jul 30, 2005 5:35 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
guidedbygrace
Sat Jul 30, 2005 4:22 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Sun Jul 31, 2005 9:13 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
guidedbygrace
Sun Jul 31, 2005 9:26 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Sun Jul 31, 2005 9:53 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
guidedbygrace
Sun Jul 31, 2005 10:42 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Wed Aug 03, 2005 2:47 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Wed Aug 03, 2005 3:01 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Wed Aug 03, 2005 7:48 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Thu Aug 04, 2005 4:13 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:01 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Fri Aug 05, 2005 4:42 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Fri Aug 05, 2005 11:51 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sat Aug 13, 2005 10:02 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Peter
Sat Aug 13, 2005 3:12 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Mon Aug 15, 2005 6:19 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Mon Aug 15, 2005 2:12 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Tue Aug 16, 2005 1:41 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Tue Aug 16, 2005 11:57 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Wed Aug 17, 2005 5:08 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:08 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Fri Aug 19, 2005 1:31 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Fri Aug 19, 2005 2:03 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sun Aug 21, 2005 4:42 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Sun Aug 21, 2005 2:47 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:04 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:57 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:14 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Tue Aug 23, 2005 2:30 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Fri Aug 26, 2005 2:18 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
J_Edwards
Fri Aug 26, 2005 12:26 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Fri Aug 26, 2005 6:04 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sun Aug 28, 2005 10:08 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Sun Aug 28, 2005 12:41 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Tue Aug 30, 2005 6:47 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:46 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:19 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sun Aug 21, 2005 5:06 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Sun Aug 21, 2005 5:41 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sun Aug 21, 2005 11:09 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Sun Aug 21, 2005 2:38 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Mon Aug 22, 2005 9:49 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sat Sep 17, 2005 4:58 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Sat Sep 17, 2005 5:08 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Sun Sep 18, 2005 11:51 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Sun Sep 18, 2005 5:25 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Mon Sep 19, 2005 3:16 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Mon Sep 19, 2005 5:41 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Paul_S
Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:16 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Tue Sep 20, 2005 10:20 AM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Pilgrim
Tue Sep 20, 2005 4:27 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized
Anonymous
Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:00 PM
Re: "We sometimes allow children to die unbaptized. ."
J_Edwards
Sat Jul 02, 2005 2:45 PM
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