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J_Edwards said:
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B57,

Yes I do believe in sin before adam sinned, else where did the serpent come from ?
So you affirm then sin cannot exist without a sinner and that the first sinner was Satan? Was he created prior to God creating sin "in your way of thinking"?

The premise was, do I believe that there was sin before adam sinned ? Yes I do.

[qoute] Was he created prior to God creating sin "in your way of thinking"? [/qoute] I don`t know, but thats not the issue. The issue is that God created everything and everyone including sin , and including satan for His purpose and pleasure. God does not have to be evil, to create evil !

isa 45: 7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

I know the context , don`t bore me with that , you should not limit the word evil there to just calamity, just as you don`t limit light to just light, or limit darkness to just darkness. or peace to just civil peace <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/bash.gif" alt="" />

evil in that verse is the heb word RAH = 1) bad, evil

a) bad, disagreeable, malignant



b) bad, unpleasant, evil (giving pain, unhappiness, misery)

c) evil, displeasing

d) bad (of its kind - land, water, etc)

e) bad (of value)


f) worse than, worst (comparison)

g) sad, unhappy

h) evil (hurtful)

i) bad, unkind (vicious in disposition)

j) bad, evil, wicked (ethically)

1) in general, of persons, of thoughts

2) deeds, actions


7451 ra` rah from 7489; bad or (as noun) evil (natural or moral):-- adversity, affliction, bad, calamity, + displease(-ure), distress, evil((- favouredness), man, thing), + exceedingly, X great, grief(-vous), harm, heavy, hurt(-ful), ill (favoured), + mark, mischief(-vous), misery, naught(-ty), noisome, + not please, sad(-ly), sore, sorrow, trouble, vex, wicked(-ly, -ness, one), worse(-st), wretchedness, wrong. (Incl. feminine raaah; as adjective or noun.).